Author Topic: Think I've found me a warbow stave...  (Read 6712 times)

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Offline Lucasade

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Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« on: October 24, 2014, 12:35:14 pm »
... cut yesterday from an ancient yew in a Birmingham churchyard, not imported from Italy/Spain/inaccessible yew habitat halfway up a lofty mountain that gets 1cm of rain a decade.  >:D

Anyway, pictures...







It's currently 82" long and thicker than my arm. After I've cut out the bad bit I should still have just over 75". Question is, do I risk splitting it or should I cut it? I don't have a bandsaw (and they aren't very medieval anyway) so what sort of saw is best?

mikekeswick

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2014, 01:37:25 pm »
A bandsaw! Good luck with anything else...
I wouldn't try to split it.
The end grain picture of the upper half shows some dodgy wood. I would cut any excess length off that end for certain and hope you get rid of the rotten black wood and the very dodgy sapwood/heartwood that is going on there at the same time. The bottom end grain picture looks ok so you have a chance.
The real problem I see is the non-straightness of it and the large knots. It also looks like it wa a branch and the cleanest section of it is from the side of the branch eg. it's not compression or tension wood alone..wood from the side of a branch will almost certainly warp as it dries and then again when you try to bend it....

Offline Del the cat

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2014, 01:51:23 pm »
+1 on bandsaw.
Spend plenty of time looking at it before you saw.
I'd say leave full length and plenty of width, don't be in a hurry to reduce it, just get it down to a half log and seal the ends. You can cut the end off later and bear in mind the tip of a bow doesn't need much wood and once it's cut off you can't put it back on.
Prob' need some straightening, but I've seen plenty worse!
Del
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Offline Lucasade

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2014, 02:48:27 pm »
The branch was growing down at about 45 degrees - the underside is completely clean but would be deflexed, the topside has the two whacking great knots and the dead wood but the tips and handle are in line, and it would have natural reflex which you've previously said makes tillering harder. Could I put the bottom side on a former to season so it straightens out?

I'll have to ask around to see if anyone I know has a bandsaw I guess.

Offline WillS

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2014, 03:29:13 pm »
You could split it if you were careful.  Just take some time to work out the best place to start it.  If you put an axe in at various places along the line you want, on both sides of the log it will usually split down that line. 

In an ideal world, you want the wood that was growing on the topside of the branch.  That's the tension wood, and will have tighter grain and will (usually) make a better bow.  The bottom side is compression wood, and will be more coarse.  That said, quite often wood surprises you and you can get some superb bows from compression wood.  Might not make a fantastic warbow however.  You'll need to decide whether you work towards a heavy weight or not before you crack on with it.

You could use a former - I don't know how well that will work.  You're probably better letting it season naturally, then straightening later.  I've heard of a method (can't remember where) of taking a fresh, unseasoned stave and cutting the belly taper first before the width and letting it season like that.  Apparently it will pull itself straight or into reflex as it dries.  Could be complete garbage though, so possibly worth trying on something less valuable...!

Offline Lucasade

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2014, 07:25:28 pm »
Given the longbow design was produced to maximise bows per log, even with my splitting skills being vastly less than people back in the day it must be possible to split it in half. I'll practice on some other bits and see if I can get a good technique together, then by the time I've failed to find a local bandsaw I may be confident enough to go for it.

Offline WillS

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2014, 08:53:03 pm »
I don't have a bandsaw either.  Every log I've worked has been split.  Sometimes you get really unlucky and it sucks but with care and attention it should be fine.  That log doesn't look at all bad.  Remember it's easier to correct bends that are front to back than side to side, so split with a thought to the half log you'll end up with.

Ideally you want any big knots smack in the middle of the split itself, so they end up being chopped away as you reduce.  Always put the axe in the middle of all knots and hammer them in so you end up with lots of small splits in the knots.  It will encourage the main split to go through them, rather than wander around the sides.

Oh, and keep rolling it over and checking the opposite side.  It's easy to think the split is running true from on top, but miss the fact that it's twisting within the log and splitting at an angle. 

Offline Del the cat

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2014, 04:34:19 am »
Given the longbow design was produced to maximise bows per log...
That sounds like some bloke sitting in front of a CAD station worked it out >:D.
I expect the longbow design was around long before maximum yield was a consideration.
Del
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Offline mullet

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2014, 11:04:00 pm »
Well, I don't build War Bows and never get a chance to cut Yew unless I sneak into the National Forest in North Florida and cut one of the only trees in Florida, but, if it was me, I'd cut that crappy end off so I could see what is going on. Then I'd beg, borrow, or suck up to someone that had a Bandsaw and cut it in half.

Kinda like trying to split a million dollar diamond after reading how to do it on the Internet with the hammer and screw driver in your garage. ::)

Is this your first bow?
Lakeland, Florida
 If you have to pull the trigger, is it really archery?

Offline Lucasade

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2014, 10:34:17 am »
I've not actually built anything yet but I've got quite a long queue that this is now in. I'm the sort of person who likes to have the whole process mapped out in my head before I start hence why I'm asking lots of questions up front. I spend a lot of time splitting wood so I'm not just aiming in the dark - but decent yew is rather hard to come by when you have to cut it yourself so I want to be confident I'm doing the best thing before I accidentally wreck it. The other problem I have is that the only bandsaw I can think of locally is in a timber yard who will quite possibly either tell me their insurance won't cover it or charge me for the time. The crappy bit is definitely going at some stage!

Del - point taken but the D-section longbow is very efficient in terms of output per log and I'm fairly sure the medieval bowyers didn't have bandsaws! Of course they were getting their yew for free and in large quantities...

mikekeswick

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2014, 04:02:13 am »
I doubt very much wether it was free....
It was also very straight and not twisted...anyone can split a straight untwisted log.
The split won't travel as anticipated due to the dead wood. You COULD split it but the safe way is to bandsaw it.

mikekeswick

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2014, 04:03:47 am »
My advice is to go out and look for a plumb straight ash to make a heavier bow if that's what you want to do. Straight, straight, straight! And don't listen to all the nonsense about ash not making good heavy bows - it definately can!

Offline Lucasade

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2014, 05:22:34 am »
I've got an ash log drying in my shed. To be honest I'm not expecting to get a finished bow from it but it's good to have a full size piece to practice techniques on. I'm always looking for nice bits. Found a beautiful one but the council said I can't have it  >:( There's a superb straight elm 10 feet long with no side branches at all growing just round the corner from my house but it will require a cunning strategy to get the council to say yes so it will hopefully not have got Dutch Elm before I get to it!

I asumed the medieval yew as it was collected as a tax would be doled out to the official bowyers as a piece rate contract?

Offline Del the cat

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2014, 09:30:08 am »
...
I asumed the medieval yew as it was collected as a tax would be doled out to the official bowyers as a piece rate contract?
I think you'll need to submit a freedom of information request to Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs for that information ;) >:D
Del
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Offline Lucasade

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Re: Think I've found me a warbow stave...
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2014, 04:56:55 pm »
 ;D