Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Around the Campfire => Topic started by: Marc St Louis on October 24, 2017, 05:03:53 pm
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I was contacted recently by someone who wanted one of these, see picture below. He said that the manufacturer of the bow wouldn't come down on his price, so he looked to me....should I be insulted? I told the guy that this thing was a glass bow and I didn't work with glass plus it didn't even look like a real Penobscot. I showed him a picture of the real thing, saying something along the lines that this was a thing of beauty while the other thing was kind of ugly. He came back saying he didn't like the looks of the real thing and that the ugly glass stick looked good to him ::)
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The 4 silencers are a nice touch.
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Id say id make it, for twice what the other guy charges.
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I guess you could look at it 2 ways...
1. Forget about this guy's request cause he doesn't seem to have the best understanding of bow making.
2. See it as a challenge, come up with a design similar to the glass bow in the picture with wood and/or wood/horn/sinew.
If I had your skills and experience I might go for option #2, but if it were me I'd definitely stick with option 1.
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So many people get their idea of what a bow should look like from video games. (There is no emoticon for shaking my head ;D)
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There is no way I would make something that looked like that, as I said...ugly. The company that makes these advertise them as high performance
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I wonder what their definition of high performance is.
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I wonder what their definition of high performance is.
Buyer's perception of performance is a direct correlation to the amount of money you can skin out of their wallet.
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It's bad when someone just wants to make a dollar off something different, No regard to history of the Penobscot bow,and the people who made it.
I would not make it like that, even if I could... LOL
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I'd tell him to get his
10 7yr old daughter to make him a papier mache one with lots of sequins and sparkles and dayglo paint.
That would probably satisfy his abysmal taste. ::)
I think you can quite justifiably feel insulted, (or I'm willing to feel insulted on your behalf ;) )
Del
PS. My pat hate is people who say... oooh Penobscot, that's like a compound isn't it?...
Arrrrghhh no... It's the damn opposite.... >:(
calm calm... must have tea...
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That thing is uglier than a Compound and looks just as heavy. I'd pass on it. If he wants one bad enough he'll save his penny's and meet the manufacturer's price.
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The 4 silencers are a nice touch.
Ai'nt that the truth!!How in the world that looks good is beyond me!!!Talk about a nightmare walking through the brush.There it is.
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Mark
I have a friend who is a guide/outfitter. He is very selective about the work he takes on, as he wants to enjoy his trips as much as he hopes his clients do. The customers he declines are told that "I am booked up for the foreseeable future".
The statement is true because he only takes on one trip a year. (He works a regular job the other 50 weeks a year, and the trip is his vacation also).
It seems that his reputation is very good and the demand for his work remains high. Perhaps the market perception is "the guy must be good because he is always booked up" :)
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Mark
I have a friend who is a guide/outfitter. He is very selective about the work he takes on, as he wants to enjoy his trips as much as he hopes his clients do. The customers he declines are told that "I am booked up for the foreseeable future".
The statement is true because he only takes on one trip a year. (He works a regular job the other 50 weeks a year, and the trip is his vacation also).
It seems that his reputation is very good and the demand for his work remains high. Perhaps the market perception is "the guy must be good because he is always booked up" :)
:OK
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I never had any intention of making something like that, not for him or anybody. I was flabbergasted when he said he didn't like the looks of the real thing. That was the end of the conversation
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I realize that is not a starter design, but how much work does it entail? That would be a real interesting project! Who makes them on the original design? Got to do more research.
Hawkdancer
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He may well like more something like this ;D
(http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20131214174529/lotr/images/thumb/2/2f/Hobbit11.jpg/500px-Hobbit11.jpg)
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He may well like more something like this ;D
(http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20131214174529/lotr/images/thumb/2/2f/Hobbit11.jpg/500px-Hobbit11.jpg)
lol ;D
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How far will that launch an archer? >:D >:D
Hawkdancer
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White Wolf Archery, makes this thing under their high performance line of bows. It sells for 1514.00
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Thats as ridiculous as spelling the word "way" with the letter F.
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I appreciate the work that went into making the glass monstrosity, but it's still pretty ugly looking. I much prefer the traditional penobscott bows. Sometimes I'll add a little extra flare to one like adding sayhas to the smaller bow but that's about it. (I know it's not traditional but they sell better in certain markets.) I too would refuse to do work like this because I feel it takes away from the history of the penobscott. Not to mention I really dislike working with fiberglass for many reasons!! I generally ignore requests like this because most of the time they don't appreciate the work that goes into a handmade bow. They want you to do the same amount of work at half the price which in itself is insulting. Just recently turned down work to reproduce a bow from some video game because the laws of physics just make it impractical and not possible.
G-Monee >:D :BB (SH) :NN :-D
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After a decade and a half of watching, waiting, and semi-regular efforts at research, I have yet to see evidence of any "Penobscot bow" with the double limbs that have been authenticated by a historian of any reputation.
But to then bastardize it even further by making it out of effing-glass is travelling deep into the Land of Absurdity, in my opinion. Frankly (there is a poor pun there considering the oldest extant Penob' bow came from a white guy that claimed to be Penobscot, named Frank Lola or Frank Loring), this just smacks of low rent cultural appropriation. It's disingenuous.
I can see making one from all natural materials as a study in hypothetical historical reproduction. And if it shoots well, fine, enjoy it. But please do not wrap it in fallacious legend in hopes of building a credibility where none can exist. Let the bow honestly stand or fall on it's own merits.
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I appreciate the work that went into making the glass monstrosity, but it's still pretty ugly looking. I much prefer the traditional penobscott bows. Sometimes I'll add a little extra flare to one like adding sayhas to the smaller bow but that's about it. (I know it's not traditional but they sell better in certain markets.) I too would refuse to do work like this because I feel it takes away from the history of the penobscott. Not to mention I really dislike working with fiberglass for many reasons!! I generally ignore requests like this because most of the time they don't appreciate the work that goes into a handmade bow. They want you to do the same amount of work at half the price which in itself is insulting. Just recently turned down work to reproduce a bow from some video game because the laws of physics just make it impractical and not possible.
G-Monee >:D :BB (SH) :NN :-D
I have turned down a number of these video game bow builds as well for that same reason. I had one guy come back and tell me it had already been built and pointed me to a video, which was nothing more than a crudely made D bow with attached pieces to make it look like the bow in question. I gave him my opinion on that as well (--) ;D
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Yikes, that's horrendous
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Honestly, the challenge of making a video game or movie proo bow that functions sounds like a fun challenge to me. If i had a place here in Toronto amd wood to work, id give it a go.
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the second pair of silencers is hilariously stupid :o
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Crows head lists a hickory finished bow for $199, and an unfinished tillered kit for $139. What does the Penobscot nation say about this thing? If it is authentic, and somewhat ancient, there should be some artifact evidence, but that region is a high humidity area, and wood will rot away quickly, as we know. I would think there would be some ethnology research works somwhere at one or more colleges or universities in their territory. One site credits the design to Dr(?) Frank Loring(?) around 1900, another claims it is a very ancient design dating back to at least the Viking incursions. Guess I will do some checking for valid research. Might keep me out of trouble.
Hawkdancer
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Another question, do Hamm and Alley mention it in their writings? JW, let me know what you found in your efforts, and I will try other sources, no point in doing it twice!
Hawkdancer
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Marc,
I think you are way ahead of us on this topic. I noticed that you posted pics of a museum bow you copied some 12 years ago. It looks very much like what Crows Head offers. What is the background on the bow? What museum? Any history, ethnology? Thanks,
Hawkdancer
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Crows head lists a hickory finished bow for $199, and an unfinished tillered kit for $139. What does the Penobscot nation say about this thing? If it is authentic, and somewhat ancient, there should be some artifact evidence, but that region is a high humidity area, and wood will rot away quickly, as we know. I would think there would be some ethnology research works somwhere at one or more colleges or universities in their territory. One site credits the design to Dr(?) Frank Loring(?) around 1900, another claims it is a very ancient design dating back to at least the Viking incursions. Guess I will do some checking for valid research. Might keep me out of trouble.
Hawkdancer
Frank Loring had no doctorate. From most accounts he was of European descent and mostly made "Big Thunder" noise without much lightning. Good luck finding documentation that can stand up to peer review. If you find anything, I'd love to hear it. The earliest Penobscot double bow dates to Frank Loring and is highly suspect historically.
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I wonder what he had in his pipe >:D! Maybe Marc has some tracks that might lead somewhere! I know there are a number of folks who "pass for Native American or First People" who don't come close. I will start with the colleges and universities in that area, as well as the regional tribal offices. If it legit or not, there should be some peer reviews, such as thesis or dissertations. Marc's previous thread indicated there was no advantage gained from the design. I can't picture a native hunter going to all the work involved in making the double tillered double bow, unless he or she saw it on a "vision quest". I don't know if the eastern peoples did vision quests a a rite of passage. Any way, I need to refresh my research skills and update to the electronic age. I will let you know if I find anything interesting and/or legit!
Hawkdancer