Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: osage outlaw on January 21, 2013, 12:26:52 pm
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So I have this stave that has a little character in the center lengthwise and I'm wondering what would be the best design to use with it. I kind of have one in mind but I wanted to see what you guys think. Besides the center whoop-de-doo it is straight with good rings and just a few pin knots. Centering the handle on the deflexed area would make a 66" bow easily.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Hunting%20Indiana%20Buildalong/SDC15297_zps2b2bec20.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Hunting%20Indiana%20Buildalong/SDC15296_zps63277640.jpg)
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Ya better keep that under lock and key or ole Chicken hawk will come and steal it:)
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I have the twin to that one leaning againt the shop wall. Im listening.......
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That looks like a blackhawk special
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This would be an outstanding build along!
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Roy n rob are right pal ;D .... do I even need to say what id do with that >:D ..... go for it ;)
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i have one like that too Clint.mine has that swoop on both ends but going in opposite directions.what ever you do with it,good luck.that is a nice stave and will make a cool bow.
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Roy n rob are right pal ;D .... do I even need to say what id do with that >:D ..... go for it ;)
Lets here it Chickenhawk
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Get a ring chased on her....find the apex of the deflex kink and mark center...measure 32" each way from center and lay out a standard flat bow profile....cut it out....get a good a nice floor tiller on her so she's ready to heat shape over a form....then stop and wait to work on it till the classic..and ill bring my half caul ti get some nice even reflex thru each limb for a sexy r/d profile....we'll heat her up and shape her...then you can go take lunch,and when ya come back your stave and I will be gone...lol :laugh:
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I'm going to have to keep it handcuffed to my wrist at all times down there.
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Told ya he would snitch it, Clint...
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Well..I was serious up until the last comment..lol..I'm sure you know tho....but seriously get it well floor tillered,or about readily to low brace type weight and even tiller...that way it'll be ready to shape over my form if you wanna wait and do it at the classic,that way we should be able to tiller it out...tillering R/D is a breeze....just come n grab me if you need an eyeball on the tree...up to you if ya want to tho....
Maybe we'll steam them tips n put in some statics too ;) hehehehehe...even mo fun. A R/D static osage...hell yeah...now were talking.
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Told ya he would snitch it, Clint...
Yeah n your gonna be riding/laughing all the way back to pa with me while its stashed in the back of my van >:D
Roy...you gotta mark some days off n head down there...your ole @$$(literally) would love it.
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will you guys help me with my stave if i bring it down?
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here is a pic of mine Clint.
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will you guys help me with my stave if i bring it down?
I would be flattered Steve. I will do what I can untiil your shooting arrows.
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bring it steve, im sure you will be shooting it before you leave.
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Steve, bring two 1 litre bottles of Mt Dew, give one to Pearly and the other to Chickenhawk then hand them your stave. Go get a burger from the kitchen and by the time you are done eating it they will have your bow on the test range flinging arrows.
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thanks guys.i am not great with the character stuff yet.i will have a few ready to tiller when i get there.i just took the bark off a vinemaple stave and am going to get it roughed out.the vinemaple is real clean and straight.i just have no expirience with this wood.i don't have alot of time to work on things around here,so learning has been slow for me.this will be my year at the classic to make some bows.thanks alot guys.
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Steve you know there will be more than enough experienced guys around to help...although it can get crazy in the shop bouncing from guy to guy giving them help when we get outnumbered and trying to work on my own as well...but that's what's so fun ;)
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i know it does get crazy in the pit.i am going to get there a week early.i allway get to spend a little time with pappy and the boys before they get busy.there is lots of guys to help,but like you said there is alot of bouncing back and forth.i am going to lay off the jar and learn a little something this year. ;D
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I am going down a week early as well. Me and Pappy have a little tradin to do and I need help on my non-character staves. Ive never made an Osage bow and 'hawk assured me that there will be plenty of Osage vets down there more than willing to lend a hand or offer their knowledge. I cant wait to make a bow (with assistance) that goes "boing" instead of "cccraaack!" By the way, do I need to drum up some "stump water" that you guys keep talkin about to keep you guys hydrated at night? >:D Sorry for hijacking your thread outlaw.
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Can't wait till y'all make it down here for the classic :) outlaw that's gonna make a sweet one!
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Clint,that is a great looking stave.are you going for 66".i was thinking of cutting mine to 65.i might do what you are doing and leave it a little long.mine is 70 right now.mine is 5/8 thick at the fades tapering to 9/16 mid limb to 1/2 at the tips..
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No problem Greg. You can tell people are starting to get the itch. Seems like about half the posts on here end up talking about the Classic somewhere along the way.
I went ahead and roughed out the bow today. I had so many layers of sealer on the bow that a pencil wouldn't show up on it. I had to use a sharpie. I was nervous cutting it out but it actually went really smooth. I did a better job on it than I did on the board straight HHB the other day. Tomorrow I'll take it down 1 ring to get to the final back and then I'll cut it to thickness. It has just a little twist but nothing major.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/SDC15304_zps83f60716.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/SDC15305_zpsb34d9cc6.jpg)
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And Blackhawk, I don't know if I can wait that long to finish it up. Maybe I'll be shootin' this thing on the course down there ;)
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mine has a slight prop twist.it's not real major.i can get it out on the form.yours is looking really good.
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Thanks Steve. It will look even better tomorrow when I get it down to thickness. I think I'll turn this into a build-a-long/help-a-long. I'll need all the help I can get when it gets time to tiller this thing.
Blackhawk. Can you post a pic of your caul you are talking about. I have something in mind that might work but I'd like to see what you use.
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tillering is my big problem.i can do it,but it takes me forever.i am going to debark some of those staves you gave me tomarrow.i am tring to get a few roughed out to work on at the classic.i can't wait to hang out with you guys and learn a little something.
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We will be glad to have you in the bow shop Steve. We will laugh at all the tall people banging their heads off that one low beam. I think ChickenHawk set the record at 14 times last year ;D
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osage outlaw, where is that bubble located? Is it near perfect midstave? All of your pics make it hard to tell?
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Yes, it is dead center of the stave. I'll try to get a side view tomorrow.
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Clint,it's funny.i have never hit my head on that beam.i should stand there and hand out bandaides.
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Me neither Steve. I wonder why ;D
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Me and that beam have had a lot of "chosen" words that wouldn't make my mother proud :laugh:
Clint ill try to snap n post a pic of my form tonight if I can..I don't have a pic of it in anywhere in my photobucket gallery, or in my documents on my PC.
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alright pal ya owe me for ruining my own follow along,and making me expose my bowmaking secrets >:( :P :laugh:
heres my half caul...its 32" long I believe and will induce a ton of reflex..if you put a straight 68"+ stave over it and do each limb you can get about 8" of setback with it...it works great tho for r/d bows where the deflexed handle area just doesn't like to fit on a form,and I make all my r/d bows over this form. the backstop can be taken off by taking the bolts out. at each end is a notch cut paralleling the arc of the form for good clamping,and underneath it mostly parallels the arc as well for ease of clamping.
here is the front view of it with nothing on it
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/2013-01-22_14-52-12_714.jpg)
heres a more angled view for a better 3d perspective
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/2013-01-22_14-52-41_378.jpg)
and heres my big kinky stave in a mock set up over the form...I had to shim an area....but you should know all about shimming to correct on a form(and I wont be doing mine this exact way over the form....I just threw it on there quick to give ya an idea of what a bow looks like on it..not a very good representation cause of the funky stave)anyways...I think ya should get the jist of it
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/2013-01-22_15-02-58_942.jpg)
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Looking great Clint. Like seeing the "Outside the box" Character stuff being worked
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Thanks Keenan. When are you going to post some character osage pics? ;)
Thanks Blackhawk. That is about the shape that I had in mind. I think I might be able to use something I already have.
I spent about 3 hours chasing a ring on it today. It had a little more character than I first thought. I had to work around several pin knots and a lot of dips, bumps, and some concave spots.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Hunting%20Indiana%20Buildalong/SDC15311_zps4343109a.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Hunting%20Indiana%20Buildalong/SDC15310_zpse7d7f7bb.jpg)
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Interesting build, I'm learning some things here. Looking good so far Outlaw, hoping it works for ya.
Greg
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I'm slowly chipping away that this bow. I cut the limbs to a rough thickness today, smoothed out the profile, and got one limb thinned, shaped, and almost to a floor tiller.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/SDC15312_zpsf76669a6.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/SDC15314_zps61f91c52.jpg)
It has some nice lines already.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/SDC15315_zpseee8b288.jpg)
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Your getting fast at this stuff Clintser, looks good so far man.
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lookng great Clint.
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Yea, nice. Can't wait to see it.
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I am really liking this bow build Clint.
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Got a little more done today, but not much. I thinned out the other limb. They are just starting to flex a little when I push on the floor with it. One limb is a little stronger than the other but I'll even them out when I start to floor tiller it. It's starting to look like a bow.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15328_zps5335c146.jpg)
Since Blackhawk didn't offer to ship me his super secret reflex caul I guess I'll have to build my own ;D I borrowed the wifes rocking chair off the front porch and used it for the arc.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15326_zps0aa449bd.jpg)
I got it all smoothed out and now that I'm looking at it, it might be a little to much arc. I am stuck with it for now. My bandsaw broke :'( I was trying to relieve the blade tension and it started getting really hard to turn. The nut was siezing up on the bolt. Then the nut started spinning in the housing. I had to use a screwdriver and a wrench to get it apart. It damaged the threads on the bolt. Now I have to figure out somehow to cheaply fix it. I'm glad I have a few bows already roughed out.
So what do you think, to much bend?
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15327_zps95e2ca27.jpg)
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Slick idea there Clint...way to use ur noggin.....I think it still can work just fine...just use shims so you don't reflex it down all the way...you can shim it up right by the fades.....do a mock set up or two till you get it where you want it
I hope ur wife was either gone or ya snuck her rocking chair into the shop without her knowing
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She didn't know ;) At first I thought I could just use the chair and then luckily my smarts kicked in and realized I would probably burn the paint off of it and leave clamp marks. I would have never heard the end of that one ::)
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alright pal ya owe me for ruining my own follow along,and making me expose my bowmaking secrets >:( :P :laugh:
heres my half caul...its 32" long I believe and will induce a ton of reflex..if you put a straight 68"+ stave over it and do each limb you can get about 8" of setback with it...it works great tho for r/d bows where the deflexed handle area just doesn't like to fit on a form,and I make all my r/d bows over this form. the backstop can be taken off by taking the bolts out. at each end is a notch cut paralleling the arc of the form for good clamping,and underneath it mostly parallels the arc as well for ease of clamping.
here is the front view of it with nothing on it
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/2013-01-22_14-52-12_714.jpg)
heres a more angled view for a better 3d perspective
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/2013-01-22_14-52-41_378.jpg)
and heres my big kinky stave in a mock set up over the form...I had to shim an area....but you should know all about shimming to correct on a form(and I wont be doing mine this exact way over the form....I just threw it on there quick to give ya an idea of what a bow looks like on it..not a very good representation cause of the funky stave)anyways...I think ya should get the jist of it
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/2013-01-22_15-02-58_942.jpg)
Chris, is that HHB? I'm thinking of laying out the HHB you gave tomorrow while I'm waiting for the osage to regain moisture from forming it and sinew to dry on the horse bow.
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Its osage Dave ....good time of year to be working that hhb...should be good to go
You must like playing with fire Clint >:D
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Chris, how well does HHB take heat bending?
Sorry, Clint I didn't mean to hijack your thread. I love your rocker idea. Since you're not sitting in the rocker, would it be safe to say, "you're off your rocker" >:D
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Clint if I'd known ya needed a caul I'd have drove out there with mine. It's a lot better than Chicken Hawks caul too.
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Dave..if you just mean dry heat reflexing the limbs its best to get a good floor tiller on it,and then temper in your desired bends...just no static recurve type bends with the dry heat..use steam for that kind of heat bending. It'll take a longer time to heat and move than osage,and will bounce back a lil more after you unclamp
Roy's is better because its newer...but its the same caul traced out and copied mine..lol :laugh:
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No problem Dave :)
Roy, you would have driven all the way here just to give me a caul? That's awful nice of you. It wouldn't have anything to do with those pics I posted on TG would it ;D Let me guess, you'll drive the truck and maybe pull the trailer?
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Yup Clint I would have done that and would have brought the truck too. And if by chance ya wasn't home, I'd have left the caul in your garage, right beside your now smaller pile of Osage:)
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O man I was waiting to flip over from page 3 to page 4 and see that stave clamped up on the bottom of that rocking chair haha
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Sorry Duck. I know my wifes limits. Burning her chair is past the redline.
It don't look like much has changed but I got it floor tillered and bending evenly. I used the scraper to get rid of all the file marks and round the edges. I think its ready to get put on the caul now. I have to work the next 3 days so it will have to wait.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15329_zps14706f99.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15330_zps7c9cc613.jpg)
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Lookin Good double-ot. Can't wait to see more.
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Saw it today in person looks better than the picture vary nice work outlaw
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That's coming along nicely Clint! You gonna get it done before Blackhawk finishes his kinky stick? Josh
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I doubt it Josh. He probably has that thing done already and he's just posting some pics here and there to make it look like he's still working on it.
It was nice meeting you Ozzy. Good luck with those staves.
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I finally got back to work on my bow today. I screwed some scrap pieces to the back of the caul so I could do a little string alignment while I was reflexing it. I also removed some twist from the limb. It is a little scary bending wood this much but osage seems to tolerate it. I had to work around three bumped up pin knots. One of the knots is near the tip. It lifted a small island of a growth ring when I bent it. I left them plenty heavy so I should be able to remove it. Just in case I soaked it with thin superglue. I should have paid more attention and scraped it down to a single ring on the tip. The other limb only has 1 small pin knot so it should be a little easier.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15331.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15332.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15333.jpg)
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Looking good pal...looks like you'll have 3-3 1/2" of reflex to start with when ya finish off the other limb....:)
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Is that about about right?
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Yeah...cus you'll prob end up with 1/2"-1" of reflex when all is said and done if done right ;)
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looking good Clint.
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Lookin sweet man :)
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oh yeah, I'm watching this one close.
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Looking good Clint ;D
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Man that Yeller Wood is really shaping up...
I'll be a watchin' your next turn. :)
-gus
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I took it off the caul today and it looks pretty good. I flipped it around and started on the other side. I tried to get everything alligned and untwisted in one go at it. I will probably have to tweek it a little here and there to get lined up. My rocking chair caul turned out pretty decent. It's not a Blackhawk model 52 caul but it will work ;D
It is starting to take some shape now. I am going to need some major advice when I start tillering this thing.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15344.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15343.jpg)
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Im scared of tillering those bows......dont ask me for help buddy!
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Don't ask me either...cus I just get lucky with mine sometimes ;D
Ya know I think I hear that stave saying recurve me,then sinew back me into some serious reflex >:D
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Looks good, I'm also interested in seeing it on the tillerboard ...
good luck!
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Ya know I think I hear that stave saying recurve me,then sinew back me into some serious reflex >:D
That's funny cause I sure dont ;D I think I pushed the tips as far as I want to take them.
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I took it of the caul today. I am loving the curves on this thing. The string lines up on the edge of the handle do I might have to make one little adjustment.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15351.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15353.jpg)
And Blackhawk, you were dead on the money. 3" of reflex right now.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15354.jpg)
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Ya know I think I hear that stave saying recurve me,then sinew back me into some serious reflex >:D
That's funny cause I sure dont ;D I think I pushed the tips as far as I want to take them.
And that was funni-ER Clintser! Shut him down! He is just trying to get you to break it....dont listen to him.
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Put me on your list for one of those bad boys. I'll make you the best static I know how in trade. That has some the sexiest profile lines Ive seen in a bit.
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Holy cow that tight that almost as sexy as my wife >:D
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Man thats looking great.
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Holy cow that tight that almost as sexy as my wife >:D
is that a good thing? >:D >:D ;D
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Oooh those curves are niiiice!
Jon
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I can't wait to see this one. Please finish it soon.
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That's an excellent starting point. Can't wait to see it finished.
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That's an excellent starting point. Can't wait to see it finished.
Starting point! What do you mean starting point! It's taken me a lot of work to get it to this point :D
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Man that is look'n AWESOME.
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That should be a quick one. I think my rocking chair will be heading out to the garage soon. I wonder how long it will take my wife to notice >:D
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It's been a while since I worked on this bow. I got sidetracked on some other projects but now I'm back at it. I added some tip overlays. I'm not sure what kind of wood it is. My dad tore apart an old Steinway piano from the 1800's and he saved some of the parts for me. The wood I used for the overlays was from that. It smells sweet when I cut it, almost like cherry candy. The piece wasn't very big so I made some short basic overlays out of part of it.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15373.jpg)
I got them shaped today.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15391.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15392.jpg)
And then I started trying to figure out how to tiller this thing.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15393.jpg)
I had to leave the long string longer than I usually do. When I tried to snug it up the string would slip to one side or the other of the rounded lever limb tips. This is as far as I got tonight. I was just trying to get them evened up. I am open to any and all help on tillering this thing. Attn: Blackhawk ;)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15396.jpg)
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If you go to a 3 inch brace height, the string should stay on the bow and it will put more stress on the limb tips at the same time. JMHO:)
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That was the plan for tomorrow Roy. Get it evened up and then try to brace it.
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Atta Boy:)
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Man, I want to give one those a try. Well, it would probably be 5 or 6 tries to get one that shoots. But, it would be fun journey. It would probably save me more time, money and wood to just go stay with Blackhawk for a week during that attempt. haha
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+1 roy....with reflexed bows you cant go to a brace lower than 3" because it will just want to flip on you....so when I tiller whether using my tree like I used too or floor tiller,i get the tiller as close to dead nuts as I can and with about ten pounds left to go before I even brace it because of this...and ill go right to a 3 1/2"-4" brace. that way you don't have flipping issues,and itll be much easier to brace and not have too much tension on it.
tiller critique....both fades are stiff...all your bend is concentrated mid limb....I know its gonna look like big ole hinges off the fades,but you need to get those 5" or so moving...its pretty easy to see by your unstrung and bending on the tree pic...also are you making stiff lever tips? if not then you need more bend out past the outer third as well. I would def get the fades bending first before you brace it
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Clint Im no wiz at r/d's. One thing that helped me understand the whole near limb movement thing was looking at the bow at rest and then pulled on the long string. The first 10" are unchanged. That got me see'in what I needed to get moving. Thats why its a breeze to make ultra light r/d bows if ya' aint careful.
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Lookin good Clintster! The tip overlays are Brazilian Rosewood. I'd recognize that black spiderweb from a mile away. Almost extinct now. Got used up for guitars and old stanley plane handles.
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I have been fighting the tiller on this thing. I think it is about as good as it is going to get. The limbs come off the handle at a slightle different angle and causes it to look a little off I think.
45# @ 28"
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15415.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15417.jpg)
I also got the handle rough shaped. I think it looks good with the overall shape of the bow.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15419.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15418.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/SDC15421.jpg)
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Cool bow!
Btw,i think someone been testing the sharpness of his broadheads :)
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Its a lil off but close....funky looking that's for sure...that one is def messing with my eyes the longer I look at it
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That looks challenging. I Like when they have that perfect natural arrow pass. Shoots like a cut-in shelf without having a cut in shelf. 8)
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Those tip overlays are rosewood, rosewood got its name drone the smell. If it is that old it is probably Brazilian rose wood. In my opinion the best smelling woods out there, and the best wood for acoustic guitars. But that is one charactory bow, looks cool. Hard to tiller well done.
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Cool bow!
Btw,i think someone been testing the sharpness of his broadheads :)
If you are referring to the bald patch on my arm, good eye. I've been sharpening some knives.
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man what a scary bow to tiller, glad it's you and not me, this one and the last one BH posted remind me of those Egyptian angular bows, gonna be quite an accomplishment when you get her shootin', Bub
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She's a beaut. How does it shoot?! Very inspiring build along thanks
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I haven't shot it yet. I need to thin down the tips first.
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Well this bow is done and finished and somehow came home with me from tennersee ;D....ole sneaky clintser worked on it at Dave's in Kentucky and even got my advice on it,and he surprised me with it down at the classic,and gifted it to me ;D 8) ....thanks pal...I'll try n get some pics up as soon as my classic hangover is over....thanks again pal ;)
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Clint is a sneaky
bas rascal for sure. ;)