breaking tooooo many

[jape]

Well I am fed up, I didn't mind blaming my bad aim for most of them but too many wooden arrows break with the smallest off-centre impact or if they hit the wooden supports and miss the hay bale! I have lost or broken two dozen POC or Victorian Ash (fine grained eucalyptus) in a year. Now I know what I am doing a bit more I just made a dozen POC arrows and two broke in the first hour! OK one hit the support but one just broke in the hay bale! I spent three days fletching and painting them, got them slightly over spined (45-50 for a 45 bow) and spent HOURS tuning them individually.  And the money wasted is adding up. I think maybe arrow wood might not be all that good these days, I dunno, not so tight grained or something? I was given two, twenty year old very light weight arrows, look like beech or ash, for mucking around and although badly spined they have hit everything from a tin shed to a number of trees and survived while POC and VA seem to shatter behind the point, sometimes across the shaft and twice in the bloody bow as I fired!
I have read many posts here and a lot of you say bamboo is very strong. Will I be wasting my time going for that next? Or should I just get some allies like my mates tell me too?

[Cromm]

Hi, What kind of bow do you shoot? And what kind of points? Do you  taper the wood to put the points on or are they the parallel sort,because I've found that the parallel points work better for me because there being more wood at the tip when hitting something there's less chance of it snapping.

[jape]

Hi Cromm, I am using both a boo-backed eucalyptus longbow at 35# and lately a Chekmate Longhorn at 45# (it is far smoother to shoot than the lighter bow). I use VA or POC shafts of correct spine, tapered at the tip 5 degrees for tapered glue-on field points. Shafts vary from 400 to 500 gn finished and I select carefully to use none with grain runout after I got splinters in my hand from a commercially purchased 'exploding' POC shaft first time I used it.

I am fed up with throwing away three or more out of every dozen shafts for either faulty grain or excessively light weight even if spined correctly. Just getting too expensive and even the so-called premium priced 'selected' shafts were poor value. In Australia here, when I posted about the faults on forums, I got told off because no-one else it seems has these problems! But I am not that bad at making arrows, just maybe too particular about selection. For example, I bought a dozen POC at 45 to 50# spine and the mass varied from 240 to 450! I also bought 24 VA shafts and half, seriously, half of them were so bent that even heat straightening doesn't work well. I don't want to say names because so many others support these guys and they do indeed work hard at supporting traditional archers.

I also had problems with the first longbow I bought from a local maker (I was green and excited), badly gouged finish, overweight, handle popping off, glue starved boo joints etc. and got flamed for stating that on forum! So I don't want to get a reputation for just being a whiner but I truly think standards are low. Another example, I just got fifty fletches and four of them are badly creased, one or two have a quill split. Maybe that is another thread to post but my money is very tight and I expect perfect or near perfect when I buy! The Longhorn is second-hand and was quite expensive for me to buy on my pension but it is brilliant to shoot so I would love to match some wood arrows for it.

I just don't think, although I can be grumpy at times, I am that bad at working shafts. Even taking into consideration my own mistakes and the learning curve for a beginner, too many get rejected by me and of them, too many still break.

It is quite possible that a couple of unhappy coincidences and my own lack of skill have added to the woes but I just want to find a good source of shaft wood so I can carry on happily making, tuning and experimenting with different fletches and arrows. I found that ordering shafts from USA means doubling the price including postage, well out of reach thus. So ...... bamboo?

[Hillbilly]

Yep. Go with cane, bamboo, and hardwood. I can go through a dozen POC shafts in no time, but so far, I have never broken a cane/bamboo arrow. Hardwood shoot shafts are tough, too.

[jape]

Thanks Hillbilly, just found a stand of bamboo on next door's block! That is the sort of coincidence I love, after thinking about it just today so I will ask if I can have a few, the locally available shop ones for gardening are crap. Will read up the posts in this section about bamboo treatment and get to work! I assume you scrape away the shine for fletching and nock glueing. How do you add field points to them? I assume they are hollow, hmmm I best go and get some and find out!

[Papa Matt]

Jape,
 
If you don't have success with what you're trying now, let me know. I could send you some nice shafts and just ask that you pay the shipping. I'm in Indiana, and have found a local hardware store that sells hardwood dowel rods that work real nice for arrows, and I have never broken any.

-Matt

[wanabehunter]

I bought hand selected poc shafts.. I have 3/12 left... they all split or broke... im very unhappy with them.. it almost made me want to buy aluminum  ... I have poplar shafts I bought at lowes.. The only ones that have broke were on purpose when I was testing them.. shooting trees (like 15 times!) shooting cement ect... you can find good ones!

I'm set up a spine tester and go to lowes for my shafts... forget 4$ a shaft.. lowes is 70 cents...

Ive spent more on making arrows then I have my bow.. lol I bought a blitz jig for 70$, feather chopper 18$, field tips 12$, broad heads 20$, Feathers 30$, hand selected poc shafts 41$

one doz arrows..  41$+12$+20$+30$ over 100$ :S

[scattershot]

The fact that your shafts break in the bale indicates to me that they are not impacting straight. I believe you are overspined by a bunch, particularly on the 35# bow. Try a lighter spine, and maybe shoot a bareshaft or two to really get an idea what's going on.

Give that a try and get back to us.

Good luck!

[mullet]

  Definately, go for the bamboo. They are almost indestructable.

[jape]

Looks like the boo and some hardwood dowel is the go then. I will miss the smell of cedar!

Matt, that is really generous, thanks for the offer. I can get rod here cheap enough when I next drive down to the city so I wont take you up on it but I really appreciate your kindness. I will try that idea along side of the bamboo. I'm hoping  the boo will work as it grows next door for free!

Scattershot, these are all individually bare tuned shafts to the bow. That is why I got the heavier spine for the Longhorn 45/50 for a 45 bow - but two of those broke in an hour of being made. I just think POC doesn't hold up to my bad form and is not that good a shaft material these days, maybe the old timers selected from slower grown trees or something. Or are you saying I should go for the next spine group up than is usually the case? Say a 50/55 for the 45 bow and the 40/45 for the 35 longbow?

Another archer posted recently in a local forum that he broke six POC in a week when any went a bit sideways, breaking in the shaft near the fletch, not just at the point, which confirms my thinking and inspired my post here as I had just that morning broken two. Yes, we may have bad form, but the number breaking shouldn't be so high, or else beginners shouldn't use POC!

I guess my overall feelings of annoyance at poor materials and uncaring practises of some sellers has made me more intolerant than usual. The POC supplier when I enquired about the large weight difference just said that is how they come and they don't have time to sort them and the VA supplier sent me more (which I then paid for, my choice) when I complained. He reckoned the weather difference warped the shafts. Maybe, but I reckon he should have wrapped them better then. On reflection, we could all add up the bad stories and forget the good ones.

And alongside of the bad stories, there are some very helpful and kind souls amongst archers, sorta makes me feel less like a grumpy old sod!

[Hillbilly]

Jape, all the cedar shafts I've ever tried have been easily broken, I don't care much for store-bought cedar shafts. I don't really know why it came to be regarded as the primo arrowshaft material, unless everybody just likes the smell of it? I'd rather shoot arrows than sniff them. With the boo shafts, you can taper them and put field points on them just like any other shaft. If the hole in the center is too big, you can plug it by gluing a piece of dowel or bamboo skewer an inch or two into the end, and taper as usual.

[The Burnt Hill Archer]

i had the same expierience with cedar. the only good thing about em, i thought, was the smell when they broke. which was often. i got a dozen ash shafts from allegeheny mountain arrow woods 2 years ago, and i am still shooting every one. and mind you im not easy on my arrows. i glanced one off a cherry branch while squirrell hunting, 90 degrees into the ground, and not a crack. my favorite target in my yard is a 4 foot wide white oak tree. ash shafts + ace hex heads = one unbreakable arrow.
     
    i havnt gotten to mess with bamboo/reed/cane but i have heard great stuff about em.

Phil

[El Destructo]

I cant wait till the Boo that Eddie gave me is ready....because since Saturday....I have broken 5 P.O Arrows....and sliced gouges out of two more....so this was an expensive week so far...just learning to shoot this Paddle Bow that I just finished.....I am going to have to get to work on that load of Cane that Cowboy and Jesse sent me....and get away from these Sissy Cedar Arrows myself!!!

[jape]

Just realised I got Scattershot's suggestions the wrong way round! Hadn't had my morning coffee is my excuse.

The bamboo from next door is straight and strong, bright yellow stuff. Maybe that will lift my spirits, we are in damp, drizzly winter here and I do enjoy lighting the fire and sitting at my work table making arrows. A glass of single malt and a cigar will help.

El Destructo, I live with a smashed back myself, can't hardly walk a lot of the time especially after cutting my firewood, and I have to say that reading your posts always lifts the depression a bit and makes me more determined to keep trying with archery, 'good onya' as we say here.

Thanks fellas.

[mullet]

  Well Mike, the boo you have growing is Japanese arrow 'Boo, good stuff. Jape, I hit one of Pappy's metal targets with my bamboo arrow and all it did was split from the point to the fletching. That was from about 15 yards with a 62# bow, made nice sparks. It is still shootable if I wrap it.