Author Topic: boo hick buff bow  (Read 3515 times)

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Offline superdav95

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boo hick buff bow
« on: August 31, 2024, 12:35:29 am »
While i wait for my trade bow to dry im experimenting with a new advanced primitive tri lam.  its a boo backed hickory longbow bellied with buffalo horn slats.  this bow is 64" ntn and the limbs are longer then the horn slats that i have.  I decided to try out a z splice on my horn slats to lengthen it a bit.  i used ea40 to glue the splice.  we shall see how it goes.






Sticks and stones and other poky stabby things.

superdav95@gmail.com

Offline Bob Barnes

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2024, 12:39:11 am »
crazy cool!  Can't wait to see it progress into a super Dave super bow...   :OK
Seems like common sense isn't very common any more...

Offline bassman211

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2024, 05:00:05 pm »
nice

Offline Muskyman

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2024, 09:37:53 pm »
I’ll be watching. Really curious about how the horn splices will hold up.

Offline Ruddy Darter

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2024, 09:41:31 am »
Very cool 8), really interested to know how a horn lamination compares to a wood lamination...faster?
R.D.
Mon arc, mon cœur. Gardez la foi!

Offline superdav95

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2024, 10:32:12 am »
Very cool 8), really interested to know how a horn lamination compares to a wood lamination...faster?
R.D.

Thanks ruddy.  Yes they are faster.  Not by a terrible amount but they are faster.  The best combo is sinew wood and horn. My fastest composite bow shot 203 fps at 9gpp.  I’ve had some self bows close to this but more in mid 190 fps.  The biggest benefit is longer power stroke compared to all wood bows.  In essence more power/energy.   It worked for the ottoman, Turkish, Mongolian and asiatic bow builders to name a few for thousands of years.  It’s kind of a journey of mine to blend the benefits of these composite horn bows with more modern long bow style and flat bows and recurves even.  The key is to not just add a ton of mass by adding horn to a wood bow backed with sinew.  Too much is a tipping point in mass and then becomes a slug.  The sinew is a huge learning curve too that needs just the right balance of sinew to glue as too much glue can slow down a bow with added mass.  The combo of about 1/3 wood core 1/3 sinew 1/3 horn seems to work well as a basic ratio.  I’ve played around with varying ratios and some wood cores are better than others.  Osage is great bow wood for self bows and backed bows even but would not use it for a horn bow composite.  Hard white woods are better for this imo.  The fastest bow I built was a heat treated hickory about 40-50% overall thickness with 25% horn and 25% sinew.  Sorry, Long winded answer but you get the gist.   Cheers. 
« Last Edit: September 01, 2024, 04:34:49 pm by superdav95 »
Sticks and stones and other poky stabby things.

superdav95@gmail.com

Offline Ruddy Darter

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2024, 11:42:28 am »
Great info superdav95, very interesting but a bit beyond my capabilities and knowhow as it stands. I hope to try some hollow limb and or sinew backing in the near future, best of luck with this build. :BB
 R.D.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2024, 04:48:24 pm by Ruddy Darter »
Mon arc, mon cœur. Gardez la foi!

Offline superdav95

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2024, 03:55:56 pm »
got my horn slats glued up this am!  heres my crude set up.  dont mind the messy shop!  lol.  basically a inner tube wrap and clamps. 







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superdav95@gmail.com

Offline bjrogg

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #8 on: September 02, 2024, 04:14:41 pm »
Very interesting Dave. I’m watching  (-P

Bjrogg

PS Thanks for sharing. I really would like to try a sinew-HHB- horn.

Bjrogg
A hot cup of coffee and a beautiful sunrise

Offline Will B

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #9 on: September 02, 2024, 05:47:28 pm »
Very cool build, Dave. I’ll be watching  (-P

Offline superdav95

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #10 on: September 02, 2024, 09:04:24 pm »
Very interesting Dave. I’m watching  (-P

Bjrogg

PS Thanks for sharing. I really would like to try a sinew-HHB- horn.

Bjrogg

You totally should be!  It would be an awesome combo.  Hhb is pretty dense and hard obviously.  You could go little thinner on your horn then I did here.  I would say a 50% wood core with 20-25% horn and 25-30% sinew as far as thickness ratios.  This is the ratios I use for my bamboo core horn and sinew builds.  Bamboo is very dense stuff too and this ratio works well. 
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Offline superdav95

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #11 on: September 02, 2024, 09:05:01 pm »
Very cool build, Dave. I’ll be watching  (-P

Thanks will!   
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Offline superdav95

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #12 on: September 04, 2024, 03:15:48 pm »
Well a quick update on this crazy project.  It’s awesome!  What a great combo this little bow became.  The boo backed hickory bellied with buff horn with a splice for length ended up really great shooter.  My fastest speed out of this bow this morning was 194fps at 29-30” draw which is close to 42lbs shooting a 380 grain arrow.  At 28” draw it’s right at 39.5-40lbs.  The grip ended up a little small for me and my gorilla hands so this will be my wife’s new bow. I had to remove some draw weight from around 50lbs to the 40lbs in order for it to work for her.  I had taken this pretillered bow and reduced it down to around the 25-30lbs mark in order to add the belly horn slat lamination.  this added 20lbs!  Horn adds a lot.   She did some shooting with it too this morning after I put a few dozen shots through it and didn’t explode.  I guess she is used to hearing me blow up my experimental bows!  At her draw around 26” it’s about 35-36lbs draw which is perfect for her.  The splice on the horn to lengthen was really the experiment for this one.  I figured the horn would be a good match up with the hickory and boo backing.  The pre tiller saved me a lot of time on this one and finnished up pretty quickly.  Ill be making more of these and may see if i can get my hands on some longer horn slats and build another.  the z splice functioned well after several dozen shots just fine but im not crazy about the asthetics of the splice.  in retrospect i should have done a v splice about 2" long that was centered to look better.  anyway a good test and to my estimation a pass.  Also another crazy observation... its reflex is holding strong at 6". upon glueing up the horn I had added about and inch extra onto the 4.5" reflex and clamped it all down to let glue set.  after unwraping it and cleaning it all up a bit i noticed it was around the expected 5.5" or so. I put a few shots through it and it was a little over 50lbs.  felt really fast but was getting dark so i shut it down for the night.  got back at it the morning and my wife commented on how much she liked it.  the grip was a little small for me so i reduced the weight.  upon doing this the reflex increased to 6". ahhh what now??? The only explanation i can think of for this is the increased compression of the horn was stabilizing the tendancy of the tension stiff bamboo to pull more reflex as the horn was reduced.  still scratching my head though on this one.  If anyone has a better explanation Id love to hear it.   

heres a video

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ril2idrvon2jmpbflqjrb/IMG_9067.MOV?rlkey=gz484vnkd1pg1jp2rfan9si9l&dl=0





















« Last Edit: September 04, 2024, 04:03:29 pm by superdav95 »
Sticks and stones and other poky stabby things.

superdav95@gmail.com

Offline Ruddy Darter

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2024, 05:22:56 pm »
What a beautiful bow, very cool and your wife must be very happy.  (-S
R.D.
Mon arc, mon cœur. Gardez la foi!

Offline Muskyman

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Re: boo hick buff bow
« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2024, 05:40:32 pm »
Looks great Dave. Never ceases to amaze me how fast you crank out these great pieces of work.