New bowyer, new here, lots of questions.

[BoisBrule]

Hello, from Canada.

I'm new to making bows, but enjoying it greatly. Started with board bows, but moving into cutting my own staves, and making the best bows I can out of local woods...

That said, local hardwood (if I limit myself to native woods) is pretty much limited to Paper Birch. Black spruce, white spruce, jack pine, tamarack, trembling aspen round out the rest, with some small chokecherry and pincherry (both grow to great sizes for walking/hiking sticks, but no larger. Arrows, perhaps?)in the mix. I live in a region that gets extremely cold, & has very long winters.

Every birch tree I have cut is twisted badly (>90 degrees over 6 linear feet, last one I cut was almost 180 degrees over 6 feet) I have yet to find a single one that isn't. All the elders I speak to (use birch for snowshoe frames), both here and back home (even farther north) say that they usually find 1 in 10 birch that are useful for them.

So I am leaning towards... black spruce. Backed with sinew most likely, possibly rawhide, and cut from compression wood (easy to find here). Wide limbed, as long as is reasonable, are my thoughts. Pyramid or flatbow in design.

But I have some questions about using compression wood. I can find leaning trees growing all over the hillsides on my property, but the trees that are really catching my eye, are the "plow wind survivor" trees... trees that have been almost entirely toppled, but have survived and are now growing in hard upper-case "J" shapes. But, I may be overthinking this, so bear with me. If I am, feel free to tell me so.

My mind says the "inside" curve of that "J" would be dense, as the tree grows from horizontal back to vertical, but logic says that the outside curve would be the compression wood, no? If I do cut a stave from the outside curve, should I build the bow "backwards", with the belly to the outside of the tree? Or, do I skip the rounded part of the "J" entirely, and cut my stave from the straighter wood above it?

Or, should I just stick to a good old straight, hillside, leaning tree?

I know spruce isn't a great wood for bows, but I am hoping that with the combo of our deep cold winters, slow growth, and compression wood, I can make something serviceable, true and honest to my area and heritage, if not in "style of bow" at least in the materials.

I would welcome any and all opinions and ideas. Thank you.

[bradsmith2010]

I dont have experience with that wood, but if that is the wood you have,, try it and see what happens,,try both sides of the tree and see what works best,,

[Deerhunter21]

First off, Welcome!!!! I dont have a ton of knowledge of spruce and all that sort but heres what i would do, cut the tree, use the outside of the tree as a back no matter the shape, dry it, and then maybe go find some other types of trees like elm and all that. I wouldnt limit yourself to wood that youll really struggle making a good bow out of just because its native. then when the spruce is dry, cut a piece off of it and make a mini bow. that will test the bend-ability of the wood so youll know that it wont break just because its spruce.

i remember hearing about spruce... but i cant remember it what it was about....

[BoisBrule]

Thanks for the replies! It's appreciated.

I want to clarify that one of the reasons I wish to stick to my local woods is that... well... it's what was used when there were no other choices, so it must have worked.

Not saying it works GREAT... the indigenous people of the area adopted firearms extremely early, and there is very little archeological archery evidence in relation to the bows themselves (lots of arrowheads, but very little in the way of actual bows for the northern boreal forest area).

I know spruce isn't great in compression, but the hope is that with a good hard lean in the tree, maybe that will be improved.

[bradsmith2010]

Im not expert on trees, but isnt there any hardwood there,,

[BoisBrule]

Im not expert on trees, but isnt there any hardwood there,,

Paper Birch. But it tends to grow VERY twisted. Corkscrew twisted.

Aside from that... Trembling Aspen and Balsam Poplar. That's it. Black Spruce beats both in hardness and crushing strength.

The nearby city has Elm in it... but they tend to frown on cutting limbs and staves in parks... and it's non-native.

[Hawkdancer]

Welcome aboard!  Sounds like you may have to do a but of trading.  Marc St. Louis and the other Canadians should be able to give some advice!
Hawkdancer

[DC]

It's possible that the native people had to trade south for bow wood.

[Jakesnyder]

There is an drawing of a plains style sinew backed chokecherry bow in the book native American bows, arrows and quivers. Not sure your style or what your into but that has at least been done once...

[Parnell]

My thought was with Jake.  The Encyclopedias may be a good resource for ideas.  I recall examples of Cree, Lakota, and Blackfoot examples that I'm figuring would be applicable to your project.  If need be, send me a PM and I can help you out.  If you are in Sask. then I'm figuring the chokecherry reference was on the mark for shorter horse-bow design.  I've seen reference to "subarctic" bows that are longer wider conifer based "D" bows.  So the spruce?

Be curious to see what you come up with.  And, welcome to PA.

P.s.  Mullet and I did a cypress bow some years ago down here in Florida.  We are kinda on opposite ends of the continent but I imagine the cypress would work similar to the spruce?  Just figuring.  It shot pretty well and could definitely flint an arrow.  Just not the snappiest thing around.

[George Tsoukalas]

Welcome. Sorry. I have never used any of those woods. Jawge

[BoisBrule]

Thank you, gentlemen.

I've been in contact with anthropology departments across Western Canada (all extremely helpful, Dr. Roland Bohr especially), looking for info and assistance with this as well. My main focus has been on the Dene Suline (Chipewyan), and other Athabascan Peoples, so sub-arctic/northern boreal forest, generally speaking. There is some evidence of birch, black spruce and tamarack being used, but the early adoption of firearms has resulted in very little anthropological evidence being left behind.

The bows I have seen from the area (in photos from mid 20th century, keep in mind) were roughly man-sized, D-shaped bows, that appear to bend through the handle. No idea if they were "one ring" or "backwards" or anything of the sort, just general, fuzzy, black and white pics from the 40s and 50s.

I'm not so concerned with making a "true to form" STYLE of bow, as I am in making the "best bow I (emphasis on "I") can make out of the woods I can find in my backyard". I've also let every hunter I know, and some I don't, that I want their deer legs, so sinew is a non-issue. Hides, too... so my rawhide needs should be met, as well.

All this said, I've got a few more board bows to work through before I attempt this project, I'd rather not cut down any more trees until I know I can do more with them than toss them in the woodstove, but I do like to have all my ducks in a row. Overthinking is kind of a hobby of mine.

Happy I've found this place, I plan on doing an awful lot of reading here.

[DC]

Really I think that all you can do is start making bows I would make them as long as you can starting with the chokecherry. Ignore the twist until you see that it's actually causing a problem. In a lot of woods the twist doesn't seem to be an issue. I've made a few Saskatoon Berry bows(quite twisted) and I just sawed the bow out. You have to remember that when you start with bladed tools it's going to have a tendency to dig in. You will be throwing a lot of wood in the wood stove but you need heat anyway. 

[Marc St Louis]

Black Spruce is a strong wood with interlocking grain, how elastic it is might be is another matter.  I know I've made arrows out of the wood and if you bend them a bit too much, such as when you are trying to straighten the shafts, they will break spectacularly.

That said, I started making a BS bow many years ago, I had selected a tree with no knots on one side.  It was a nice stave but I made a mistake and ruined it.  The wood has very tight growth rings so any mistake is not good.  Sinew backing would take that problem out of the equation.  As a suggestion, if you do decide to try it, I would go with a length around 64~65" for a 28" draw with a width of around 1 1/4"

[willie]

I live 60 north and have some of the same woods you have. try looking for birch along road/ rr /powerline cuts where there was clearing done 25 years ago. thick stands of 5/6" diameter in creek bottoms. Birch does not split well, but one of the reasons is splits do not tend to follow the grain well. you can saw staves out of birch to get straight wood.

the most radically bent spruce compression wood is not as preferable  as a gently curving tree. there is a russian compressionwood buildalong in the buildalong section, and the bowyer is pointing to the kind of tree you need.

the service berry where I am is small, but you live in sask? is there as chance to find 2" or so diameter near by? it can make an exellent bow.

Gwich’in Athabascan Implements
History, Manufacture, and Usage According to Reverend David Salmon
Gwich’in Athabascan Implements

Thomas A. O’Brien

is a cool book