shooting at deer,,,video added

[bradsmith2010]

    I am not an expert,, and lots of guys have killed alot more deer than me with a bow,,
but I was lucky enough to hunt and shoot with two really great deer shots (Jerry Simmons,, and Byron Ferguson), and they taught me alot,,
on a good day,, I am a pretty good shot,, on a bad day and can shoot just awful,, and I am always working to be more consistant,, that being said,, I am going to give a few suggestions that have worked for me and hope some others will chime in and also ask questions,, I asked those guys a million questions,, they were always patient and willing  to expain there ideas too me,, Jerry kiiled the first deer in the first archersy season in Alabama in the 60's and killed over 200 deer,, and Byron needs no introduction,,
    Let me back up a bit,, Jerry used to say that to me,,,there are some key things that come to mind,,
both of them every day stressed how sharp my broad head should be,, and they both sharpened heads every day of the hunt,,
     no need to shoot unless its hair shaving sharp,,
     Jerry was not a trick shot,, but said no need to ever miss a deer its alot bigger than a rabbit,,
     they both like to hunt out of a tree stand and felt it was an extreme advantage with wind and sight,,
     they never hunted the same stand two days in a row, they would walk in put up the stand and hunt ,,,and bring it out after hunting,,
      they were both expert trackers,, if the blood trail was lost, they would track intuitively,, Byron found the first deer I ever shot with long bow with no blood trail,,, just walked too it,, I know that sounds unlikelly,, but I saw him do that another time as well,, he is just gifted,,
        ok about shooting,, they both liked to shoot a bow on the heavier side,, feeling like it gave them an advantage,,both had a long draw,, and good form,,
         Byron felt if you had good form and you were lined up at full draw the arrow could only go where you were aiming,, sounds easy right,,,
           
         1 Ok I think the one thing that is hard to practice is timing the shot,, at a target,, you can shoot at  your leisure,,, in the field,, the deer is dictatiing when you can shoot,,, that can throw you off,, maybe you have to shoot quicker than you pracice or hold longer than you have practiced,, that puts you in uncharted waters ,,,  so its a good idea to pracice shooting quick and also holding longer ,,,
          2.when you go out to shoot,, pay close attention to your first shot,, that is a good indicator of how you really shoot,, if you have to warm up to hit the target,, then you need to shoot closer,,
           ok I out of time for now but will continue,, all comments guestions welcome,, B

[sleek]

Wonderful reading. Thank you for posting this.

[GlisGlis]

please continue 

[Ed Brooks]

Tagging along.

[Morgan]

Thanks for posting this Brad. The first shot part makes me feel better about my shooting. My first round is always my best and I progressively get worse until I am over thinking every shot and am shooting on the bad side of rotten.  I thought it was a bad sign. I’ve never shot a deer with a bow. Had opportunities, but couldn’t commit. When I used to coon hunt a lot, I found numerous deer dead from badly placed shots that probably died hours or days after they were shot. That really messed with my head. I have been a hunter all my life, but I only hunt for animals I will utilize or animals that are causing a problem. If I were to make a bad shot, and not be able to recover the deer it would bother me badly. Now that I’m making my own bows, the draw to take game with them is pretty great. I am hoping to overcome this aversion this year...

[bradsmith2010]

good point Morgan
1 practice as much as you can within reason,,
2 limit your shots to your first shot  effecient range,,, if your first shot is good at 10 yards every day, sitting ,, standing and then from a stand, then only shoot that far,,
3. keep in mind some of the deer you saw,, might have been recoverable if the tracking was diligent,, and the only way to learn to find deer is to track them and help others track,,
4, get a dog that can help you track,,that will increase your odds dramaticly,,
5,make your best shot,, track as hard as you can,, and thats all you can do,, you can always shoot your bow for fun if thats what you like,,you dont have to shoot a deer to enjoy archery,,
   that being said,, I have shot deer that I did not recover, even with a dog,, and I did feel badly for days maybe more,, but my love of hunting with a bow and the fulfilling success I had had on other occasions out weighs the times I was not successful,,
    I made a bad shot one afternoon and came back to camp and told everyone I was quitting,,well that lasted till the next day,several weeks later the deer was seen totally recovered from my bad shot,,, that was 20 something years ago and I am still bow hunting,, I am more conservative with  the range I shoot at deer,,, and how high I put my stand,,, I can hit a target way past 40 yards,, but on deer prefer to shoot around 10 yards,,, I will shoot a bit further if need be but am always holding out for a good close shot,,,and feel like I will get it,, i like to take shots that give me the best chance of recovery,, sometimes the 15 yard shot feels the same as 10 and I will shoot,,,,I am not intending to just hit the deer,, I am intending to shoot through the vitals,,,and that makes me more careful and shoot closer,,
     I suggest you kill a deer with the bow you made make that a goal,,, and then decide if you want to proceed with your bow hunting,,
     

[Morgan]

Thank you for the tips Brad. You’ve been very helpful to me.

[bjrogg]

      Thanks for starting this thread Brad. I agree with everything you've said. I really like to practice my one shot routine. If I working in my shop I can just string my bow and take a shot. I sometimes do this several times a day.
      I'm certainly not a expert. I've only successfully taken one deer with my bow. I have learned a lot but still have a lot to learn.
      Like you said I'm shooting at the vitals and waiting for my comfort zone shot. I'm also looking for the opportunity that the deer is concentrating on something else. Maybe slowly walking by or stopped and looking at something else. I'm not going to shoot at a deer that's looking my way, or at high alert. It seems like when you watch all the outdoor shows. The wheelie bow guy's always grunt to stop the deer. I might be wrong but it just seems like that wouldn't be a good way for me. I think I'd rather shoot a deer that's slowly walking past me at ten yards than to grunt and have one stop and look at me. I usually don't hold at full draw more than a second or two at most. Actually the only deer I have shot was slowly walking past me. He was totally calm and preoccupied. He didn't have a clue I was shooting at him. If I don't feel like it's a sure thing I don't shoot. I'd rather watch one walk away than watch one run away with a bad shot. Having said that, the spike horn I just shot over top of I really thought was a sure thing. He was in my comfort zone. He was standing quartering away at about six yards. When I practice this is just automatic can't miss. I do really like hunting from a tree but I do still need to work at it.
       I might be wrong about this to, but I really think that deer have a much better chance of surviving and healing up from a poor shot with a selfbow than a wheelie bow. Not saying they all survive and heal, just that they have a better chance.
      I really do enjoy the hunt. I love trying to get super close and just watching the animals. I don't mind not shooting if I'm still getting close and enjoying the hunt.
Thanks again for the tips
Bjrogg
   

[chamookman]

Fred Bear always said "It's not about how far You can kill a Deer, it's how close!"  . Bob

[BowEd]

Morgan...I used to have the same thoughts about archery before making bows myself too finding many dead deer while coon hunting.Got a shed full of small and large racks never found by the shooter.Being patient and selective will be rewarded most times.Last night I had 2 does under 10 yards from me.Could of shot 1 of them easily,but there was a nice 8 point buck standing 70 to 80 yards off watching these does.I waited and waited.He never did come.In fact 1 of the does went out to meet him and the other went the other way eventually as it just plain got too dark to shoot....lol.Does never had any idea I was there.So nothing is spoiled and it was interesting and fun watching it all go down.There will be a next time.It's when action is like that that I wish there was more daylight.
Gotta agree though it's that first shot that counts.That's why practicing with only 1 arrow can help me.Different positions and stances with the arrow or arrows I'm going to use to hunt with.

[StickMark]

In the natural blind along side a marsh, my hunting partner pulls back his compound bow.  He is on his knees, aiming at an imaginary deer.  He lets down and informs me that he not drawn his bow at all from any position other than standing.  That is the first time drawing while  kneeling.  Two years prior, he missed caused he stood while two giants were about to be killed in self defense; they were going to run over us.  He stood up out of habit! 
BTW, that very day a non legal buck came in to that blind, 16 yards max, and would have required a kneeling draw.

Another good friend, who has killed about 70 deer with compounds, shared with him the need to shoot from all positions: sitting, kneeling, twisted up, downward dog, spiraling communist, etc... Sometimes people do not listen, lol.  I have harvested 6 in nine years, two with rifle, four with sticks bows (Arizona is a one buck a year state, so holding out for a big one can mean being a vegetarian ). Not one deer gave me the stand and deliver option.  Only one deer from a standing shot, but peering over a cliff. all others were sitting, sitting-kneeling or semi squat.  I am building the shorter, 56 inches now, Ishi bow to fit my hunting technique.

I wonder if the other stickbow hunters out West have similar experiences. 

Tradgang had a thread on Joel turner's mental-trigger method.  This is similar thread, imo.

[bradsmith2010]

    great comments and suggestions,,
ok lets go back to shooting from a stand,, its easy to pratice shooting off the ground,,
Ok,, one thing Byron did is come to a consistant draw every time,,(except flying targets)
that was a difficult one for me,,
when you are aiming down ,, easy for your draw to change and  there are some people can shoot with a varied draw,, he would draw till his broad head hit his finger,,
ok for me I always shot a longer arrow,,so I would put a piece of tape on the arrows to practice with,, at my full draw for that bow,, and practice pulling to the tape to be consistant,,
if you do that enough you will get consistant with that bow and arrow set up,,,and do it automaticly,,
   I shoot so many bows with different draws,, when I get ready to hunt,, having the tape on arrow really helps me practice,, the tape is on my stump shooting arrows too,,
    ok about the longer arrow, at one time I shot a high anchor under my eye, and at 20 yards if I put the tip of the arrow on the target thats where it hit, my point on was 20 with a longer arrow,,, this was a great hunting set up for me and killed deer shooting like that,, now as I started shooting shorter bows with no anchor that did not work,, and I had to just practice more to be consistant on game,,
     so I am suggesting  you mark your arrow and hit that mark when shooting down,,,take 5 practice arrows to your stand,, sometimes I shoot them when I get in my stand, ,probably not a great idea but I do it any way,, and sometimes at dark when I am leaving,,  bend at the waist and hit your full draw,, shoot some sitting too,, sometimes you take a break and deer comes,, no need to stand and spook it if you are confident shooting in a sitting position,,
      I have never had a deer smell my practice arrow and spook,, even though I am sure that could happen,,,
      Ok  about shooting at deer that see you,, Jerry would shoot them,, I agree a deer with no idea you are there is a best option,, but Jerry felt he had a few seconds to pull off the shot and would,, that was just his take on it,
       I have had  deer head down feeding jump out of the way of my arrow just as well as ones thta were on alert,, so I am not sure there is much difference,,,it does seem the ones slowly walking dont hear the arrow as well, but I am not certain about that either,,,if its a good angle and close I shoot and aim at the bottom of the deer,,,
        for example I shot a deer slowly walking, less than 10 yards from a tree,,,, the deer still ducked so hard that the arrow came out higher than the entrance,,the deer was not alerted and did not know I was there,, so its very hard to predict,, I think if you have the deer less than 10,, and your bow is drawn it is a high percentage shot,,I will pick a spot low,
        i dont think there is a formula that will work, you just have to shoot at deer and learn wht works best for you,, the only way to get good at it,, is shoot at them,,

   

[Morgan]

Do you guys shoot low every time when taking a shot on deer?

[BowEd]

Morgan....With me shooting from a stand is a little like shooting at something down a steep hill.I always seem to hit high holding my bow arm at the normal flat shooting level and every bow is'nt always the same either but pretty close anyway.That becomes noticeable while practicing & stump & 3D shooting.So the answer is no.

[bradsmith2010]

Ed do you mean the shot does not go low,, or that you dont hold low when shooting down,,,???yes I aim at a low spot every time,, if my arrow does anthing it will go a few inches high,, well on a 3d target its still in the kill,, but on a real deer,, a few inches high can mean a miss or hit in back strap,,,so I aim low,,every time,, I shot a deer in Tenn and aimed low at the white behind the shoulder, thats right where it hit,, not a good shot on a 3d target,, but the deer didnt go far and my 6 year old daughter was able to follow the blood trail