violating a back

[PatM]

Jack could make a bow from a curly Maple gunstock.. This boy is GOOOD!

[bubby]

Beliefs that are not founded in logic cannot be disproved with logic.

That's not true. One very prevalent and illogical belief ("quartersawn wood is stronger than flat sawn wood") has already been disproved with data, as Gangsta Bow showed. Now it's time for bowyering to learn it's lesson. Violated growth rings are not detrimental to a bow's integrity.

You do realize that building a violin has no, absolutely no commonality with building a bow and has no place in this thread

[Gangsta Bow]

show me a scientific paper which demonstrates that violated growth rings make a bow more likely to break. show me the money, frankie. until you have science on your side, it's nothing but an old wives tale. y'nah mean?

[bubby]

And we all know the dude in the video

[bubby]

show me a scientific paper which demonstrates that violated growth rings make a bow more likely to break. show me the money, frankie. until you have science on your side, it's nothing but an old wives tale. y'nah mean?

Show one that does

[Gangsta Bow]

You do realize that building a violin has no, absolutely no commonality with building a bow and has no place in this thread

that don't change the fact that it's a very widespread belief that extends beyond violins. everybody seems to think quartersawn grain is stronger, including bowyers. they're all wrong. science says so. face facts, yo. violatin' the grain ain't no thang but a chicken wang.

[osage outlaw]

Moderators, isn't there a rule about making multiple user accounts?  This guy is a joke and needs to be dealt with. 


http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,9065.0.html

[RyanY]

Jack, do you know what burden of proof is? 

"When two parties are in a discussion and one makes a claim that the other disputes, the one who makes the claim typically has a burden of proof to justify or substantiate that claim especially when it challenges a perceived status quo.[1]" - Wikipedia: Philosophical burden of proof

Also if you expect scientific data from a hobbyist community then you're going to come up short. Many of us don't care or have the time to conduct scientific studies just to "prove" what we have learned from experience. In this game anecdotal evidence is what you'll get and let me tell ya, it's produced some amazing bows and bowyers and they only keep getting better. It would be truly ignorant to ignore the massive amount of anecdotal evidence of thousands of people accumulated over decades/centuries, believing that a single scientific paper (which always have plenty of their own flaws) has any more weight.

[PatM]

Moderators, isn't there a rule about making multiple user accounts?  This guy is a joke and needs to be dealt with. 


http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,9065.0.html

 You're going to get him banned before he dazzles us with his work.

[Gangsta Bow]

Also if you expect scientific data from a hobbyist community then you're going to come up short. Many of us don't care or have the time to conduct scientific studies just to "prove" what we have learned from experience. In this game anecdotal evidence is what you'll get and let me tell ya, it's produced some amazing bows and bowyers and they only keep getting better. It would be truly ignorant to ignore the massive amount of anecdotal evidence of thousands of people accumulated over decades/centuries, believing that a single scientific paper (which always have plenty of their own flaws) has any more weight.

bows aren't getting better. this dude wrong. he needs to step his vocabulary up cuz he's startin' to sound like a flat earther. the bows I see on the internet look like some straight up dookie. all knotty, twisted, lookin' like a shillelagh. i see bows breaking all the time on forums, but most of the old injun bows are still holding the string 150 years later. can't nobody top the records the Khanites were setting 700 years ago. what's ignorant is holding on to these old fashioned beliefs without critically examining them. see what happens when people do that is they start flying and walking on the moon. word!

[osage outlaw]

Moderators, isn't there a rule about making multiple user accounts?  This guy is a joke and needs to be dealt with. 


http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,9065.0.html

 You're going to get him banned before he dazzles us with his work.

I'm fine with that.

[Gangsta Bow]

Moderators, isn't there a rule about making multiple user accounts?  This guy is a joke and needs to be dealt with. 


http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,9065.0.html

 You're going to get him banned before he dazzles us with his work.

I'm fine with that.

proof ? add me on facebook if you think i'm not real. y'all like the spanish inquisition up in here with your paranoid, censorship loving, anti-science mentality.

[RyanY]

Also if you expect scientific data from a hobbyist community then you're going to come up short. Many of us don't care or have the time to conduct scientific studies just to "prove" what we have learned from experience. In this game anecdotal evidence is what you'll get and let me tell ya, it's produced some amazing bows and bowyers and they only keep getting better. It would be truly ignorant to ignore the massive amount of anecdotal evidence of thousands of people accumulated over decades/centuries, believing that a single scientific paper (which always have plenty of their own flaws) has any more weight.

bows aren't getting better. this dude wrong. he needs to step his vocabulary up cuz he's startin' to sound like a flat earther. the bows I see on the internet look like some straight up dookie. all knotty, twisted, lookin' like a shillelagh. i see bows breaking all the time on forums, but most of the old injun bows are still holding the string 150 years later. can't nobody top the records the Khanites were setting 700 years ago. what's ignorant is holding on to these old fashioned beliefs without critically examining them. see what happens when people do that is they start flying and walking on the moon. word!

Conveniently avoid my point about burden of proof, throw in some good ol ad hominem, and make points without any evidence. Seems to be some romanticism about Native American knowledge somehow lacking the same "old fashioned beliefs" that only modern men create. People are people, guaranteed their beliefs about bows were founded on the same anecdotal evidence and experience that ours are. But anyways, beginning a discussion with the sole purpose of changing others minds as opposed to wanting to create discussion to learn will only result in this kind of bickering. You've clearly followed the former. 

[Gangsta Bow]

 burden of proof

https://encyclopediadramatica.se/The_Burden_of_Proof

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof#Abuse

[Jack Napier]

Conveniently avoid my point about burden of proof, throw in some good ol ad hominem, and make points without any evidence. Seems to be some romanticism about Native American knowledge somehow lacking the same "old fashioned beliefs" that only modern men create. People are people, guaranteed their beliefs about bows were founded on the same anecdotal evidence and experience that ours are. But anyways, beginning a discussion with the sole purpose of changing others minds as opposed to wanting to create discussion to learn will only result in this kind of bickering. You've clearly followed the former. 

Ah the good ol "Burden of Proof" fallacy. Thanks but no thanks, Socrates, I don't follow your misguided  philosophical dogma. Maybe you'll want to take that up with the Hague or whoever cares. When it comes to anecdotal experience, who would you listen to? Because Native Americans blew a hole through Viking selfbowyers when they tried to settle Canada. Eskimos blew a hole through the Viking selfbowyers on Greenland. Mongolians used violated grain wood and destroyed the selfbowyers of the world. Let's face it, these people knew what they were doing. They made the best, most efficient bows. So if we're going to go from anecdotal experience on bowmaking, we have to go with Native Americans. Science already proved their bows superior in one way. Let's watch it happen in another.