Author Topic: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions  (Read 12966 times)

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Offline chrisgedwards

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Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« on: June 04, 2015, 03:23:01 pm »
Hello everyone! Today I'm bringing two beautiful straight grained pieces of hickory to the love potion collective at American steel. These two boards are 2 inches wide, 72 inches long and I planed them down to 07/16" thick. I need feedback on my design, I've got a few concerns I'd love help with.

First off I'm making these two bows identical, one for me and one for someone who asked me to make them one. They will be stained with a dark blood red, polyurethane and then laser etched and painted by a psychedelic and fractal artist I know.

DIMENSIONS: 68-70" end to end, 2" wide, 8.5" handle fading 1.5" on each end, almost center cut, 1.5' of limbs from center stays parallel before fading off to 1/2" at tips. The handle will most likely be put in with smooth on, hickory 1/4" then a laminate of dark wood followed by hickory. Would love input on thickness here. Hoping for 50lbs at 27".

I want that width for the purpose of artwork surface area as well as strength considering the near center cut arrow shelf. Most hickory flat bows I read about are around 1.5-1.7" wide. Will this pose any problems?

I've had A LOT of trouble with handle pop. I just ordered my smooth on epoxy so until now I've only used tite bond 3. I even tried several Pennie nails but would rather not do that ever again. What do y'all think of the length of the handle?

Here are a few pics of my last bow. It was 1/2" thick and 62" long. Handle popped, wood cracked so I planed it down very thin to save it as a wall piece that I keep strung. Wood was so thin it didn't keep the recurved tips. I will be steam bending the tips of one of the two boards tonight. These bows tonight are also my first to be made with power tools. My previous ones were all hand tools and very labor intensive.

Thanks!


Offline chrisgedwards

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2015, 03:25:31 pm »
Having trouble with posting pics from iphone, file size.

Offline raylbird

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2015, 11:34:47 pm »
I am guessing you are having a problem with your fades that is causing the handle pops. Maybe your handle thickness is not actually fading gradually at the fades? Some side view pictures would help. If your handle pieces are mating good with bow and the fade thickness is good titebond glue will suffice. If not I would not trust the smooth on either. Again pictures would help and maybe details of your gluing process.

Offline Josh B

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2015, 11:35:35 pm »
Well first off, it seems that you're a bit too focused on the goal and not the process of attaining the goal.  Or in other words that I tell beginners that try to take every shortcut imaginable, learn to to enjoy the journey so that you may reach your destination already fulfilled.  Some shortcuts only hasten failure, especially when just starting out.  The hand tool approach is a slow process, but its also the best process for learning.  For instance, you planed the entire board to 7/16".  You've already severely lowered your chances at your 50# goal.  There is a lot of variation in wood properties, even within a given species.  Cutting it that thin might already be too thin before you even start tillering.  Also, it severely raises your chances of handle pop off.  You would be better off to glue your handle piece on to the full thickness board and then cut in gradual fades or transitions from handle to working limb.  It's hard to tell from your pics, but it looks as though you have pretty abrupt edges to your glued on handle piece.  If so, that's a certain recipe for handle pop off.  You'll have better luck if the handle feathers out to working limb.  I got out my crayons to illustrate(albeit poorly) what I suggest for changes to your design.  The top pic is what i believe you have.  The bottom part of the pic is my recommendations for improving your odds.  Even in my improvement pic, the transistions should be longer than what i drew.  Those suggestions should go along way towards improving your success rate.  As far as the power tools go, keep that at a minimum for now.  If you're using elbow grease and sweat to build your bows, chances are you will be more inclined to think out each step you take before you take it.  This will really help the learning curve and I guarantee you will be that much prouder of your accomplishments if you have a little sweat equity invested in them.  I hope that helps a little.  Josh

Offline bubby

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2015, 01:16:28 am »
Very good info gun doc, here's a link to a build and you should find pics showing how to correct your http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,35312.0.html
failure is an option, everyone fails, it's how you handle it that matters.
The few the proud the 27🏹

Offline Knoll

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2015, 05:00:24 am »
I've built a few board bows  ;)  in the year since getting into this fun hobby.  Can't recall who provided me the points Josh (Gun Doc) did in above post, but they were, for me, among the keys to greatly improving odds of success.  And a ferrier's rasp was the single best addition to my tool chest.
Good luck!
« Last Edit: June 05, 2015, 05:08:59 am by Knoll »
... alone in distant woods or fields, in unpretending sproutlands or pastures tracked by rabbits, even in a bleak and, to most, cheerless day .... .  I suppose that this value, in my case, is equivalent to what others get by churchgoing & prayer.  Hank Thoreau, 1857

Offline DavidV

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2015, 10:23:34 am »
I would not cut a sight window like in the pictures above. There isn't much meat in the riser to support a center cut shelf and it increases the chance of splitting due to the abrupt grain runout.
Springfield, MO

Offline chrisgedwards

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2015, 01:03:36 pm »
You guys are amazing! Thanks for thee very useful advice. Yes the fades on my handle suck, far too abrupt, that I'll fix right away. I'll not use my current boards, ill buy some new hickory and only plane to 1/2" and only up to the handle region so I can keep the thickness of the riser area.

Offline Jim Davis

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2015, 12:27:08 am »
If you are going to plane the whole bow, may I suggest stopping at 9/16 or even 5/8" and tiller from there.

I'd also agree with above about the arrow shelf. I never cut one at all and have no trouble getting good arrow flight. Haven't cut a shelf since the first few 18 years ago.
Jim Davis

Kentucky--formerly Maine

Offline bubbles

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2015, 11:23:21 am »
One thing that helped me with handle dips and fades was staying away from power tools a good 3-4" away from the fades and doing the working limb/handle transition all with a rasp. My fades immediately got less abrupt.

Offline chrisgedwards

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2015, 04:41:37 pm »
So I went back to love potion and threw together this bow in about an hour and a half. Decided to use the wood I already planed to 7/16, for practice. I had drunkenly messed the cuts the night before so I had to cut it way down.

70" ttt, 1.5" wide, 9" handle with 2" of handle fade on each side, titebond 1 (forgot #3 and still waiting on smooth on from 3rivers), tapers start at 5" past handle or 9.5" from center, 1/2" tips.

I'm very nervous about handle pop, I'm going to let the glue dry for 2-3 days. I may decide to use very small screw from the back into the handle. If i do this, I'll be adding a 1/32" or 1/16" hickory or redwood laminate on the back the same length as the handle or slightly larger.

Got to love working with the amphora art car with it's 10k led display going. We can even play old arcade games using it as a giant screen. The inside is floor to ceiling faux fur with a dance floor on the 2nd story and dj/bar booth. It makes quite an impression when out on the road/playa :-)

Thank you all so much for the advice, I hope to purchase more wood very soon!
« Last Edit: June 06, 2015, 08:38:50 pm by chrisgedwards »

Offline chrisgedwards

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2015, 04:43:39 pm »
Having lots of trouble with pics

Offline bubby

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensionsCD r
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2015, 04:53:01 pm »
Don't use a screw, take a heat gun and warm up the glue and take the handle OFF
Then take a 3/16" thick pc of wood 4" longer than the handle section an glue it between the bow and handle the reason the handles keep popping off is it is bending through the handle area and this will take care of that properly feathered out
failure is an option, everyone fails, it's how you handle it that matters.
The few the proud the 27🏹

Offline chrisgedwards

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2015, 05:11:06 pm »
Gah how obvious, I could have put very thin laminates on before I added the handle. Ok, I'll go ahead and leave this one as is, see if the handle pops and start a new one with this knowledge. I have the other planed board, maybe I'll just use it for backings. Need more wood!

Offline paco664

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Re: Advice on hickory board bow dimensions
« Reply #14 on: June 06, 2015, 07:38:54 pm »
this is a silly question... but why do you have a feather boa in the photos?
I'm too drunk to taste this chicken"~Col.H.Sanders