english longbow . explodes . :( why ??

[rockrush69]

It was just my practice stave of yew .... but as i move forward with my longer and better stave of yew i would like pointers or at least opinions as to why this happened .   herd is the last video of a 10 part series on youtube.  I documented the whole build along on youtube . Because i noticed there were no full builds o. Houtube of a yew elb ....please some one check the vids out and tell me what went wrong . . . . Thanks .

http://m.youtube.com/index?&desktop_uri=%2F

[rockrush69]

If that link above doesent work you can always just go to youtube and sear h " english longbow build along part 1 " and all the wY to part 10

[Bryce]

the dust will not kill you. ive been breathing it in for years.....im perfectly healthy. plus! doesnt your face gettting sweaty enough from that mask?! 
your stave looks like a premo piece of wood to me there seems to be a knot in the center of the limb but thats alright as long as you took it into account.
your midlimbs needed to bend more before you went any further. most of your bend was too close to the handle.
leaving your bow fully drawn like that was making me cringe. i understand you where making an instructional video. but that is cause for set, and possibly a broken bow. when you took the string off there where clear signs of set in certain parts of the limbs which can be used as somewhat of a guide when tillering. if such and instance happens.

del will be here soon to chime in 

[BOWMAN53]

i love how you wear the mask because of the yew dust but your smoking a cigarette lol 

 

[WillS]

I didn't wanna mention the smoking thing haha.  Irony

Not entirely sure why the bow broke, but exactly as Bryce mentioned, leaving it drawn like that is bad news and may even be the reason it went kablooie.

Might also be worth bearing in mind that strictly speaking your bow wasn't an English longbow.  That big chunky handle section is more American longbow, as a true ELB will either have no discernible handle section, or a slight swelling of the grip.  A Victorian target longbow will be mainly stiff in the middle, a bit like yours, and a true medieval English war bow will bend all the way through the middle. 

It's important to know the difference so that you don't try and match a certain tiller to a bow that doesn't work with it!

Sorry for the bow breaking though bud, never a nice experience, especially with a nice bit of yew!

[Del the cat]

Welcome to my world
It's a good quality break
What I mean is the whole thing has gone bang, not just one obvious weak point. Without carefully inspecting the bits, and decent video it's impossible to tell, even then it may not be obvious.
It did look like it was taking some set,  ( nope... the stave was deflexed to start with) was maybe a tad short and I didn't like the raised grip, it can be a lot more subtle than that, but to be fair, that's not where it failed. But a V gentle (or non existent) fade maximises the working limb. Ok I see the big knot... yeah gotta have that at or near the grip.
You could argue "Gee it's got hugely long limbs, so how come it's too short?"... but they are V highly stressed due to being narrow and thick.

I'll check back on the early parts to see what you do with the sapwood as I think I was watching the wrong guys vid!!!! .

The back is usually the key. I think I missed how you worked the back. I'd have been tempted to just take of the outer bark and leave it pristine, as it looked fairly this sapwood to start with.
Yup I see you left the sapwood alone. I think you pretty much did it all right... these things happen.
Ok it's good to mention Yews toxicity but I don't bother with a mask except maybe when scraping off the cambium (that stuff is horrible) but I do have a dust extractor on the bandsaw.

66" inches is pushing it for a relatively high draw weight. Maybe better going for 40# or allowing the knot to be say an inch outside the grip, keep full width of the stave and so just gain an extra inch or two. maybe with big knots, a patch of sapwood over the belly area adds some extra security.
Let's see the bit of wood with the knot through the back so we can see if that failed.

I've had a closer look. Forgive me if I'm wrong. but it looks like that big knot didn't go right through the sapwood. If that's right, you shouldn't IMO drill right through, just clean out all the crud with a needle file ground to a chisel point and plug it from the belly (making sure there are no air pockets left inside) that would have left the back stronger. You could maybe had had that knot just above the grip and thus gained a few inches extra length.
E.G With 33" above the knot, the knot 1" above the arrow pass, the arrow pass 1" above center that gives the upper limb 35" tip to centreline, so the overall bow length becomes 70" which is a good bit better than 66" !. For security you could leave the stave a tad wider where the knot was.

Anyhow... shame it blew... and bear in mind I could be talking out my backside as I didn't have the stave in my hand.
Better luck with the good stave.
Del

[toomanyknots]

leaving your bow fully drawn like that was making me cringe. i understand you where making an instructional video. but that is cause for set, and possibly a broken bow.

Ya, that's really bad for a bow. If your gonna do that with a tree, you should only let it sit like that long enough to either get a quick look at where you wanna remove wood, or snap a picture so you can study the tiller on your own time without causing unneeded damage to the bow. I stopped using a tree altogether for the most part, now I just use a big mirror and a tiller with a pulley rope instead of the notches.

EDIT: Plus if the bow is pulling 60# @ 24" on the longstring, it is gonna be decently heavy for it's length in the end. And you have to consider the cross section in this bow. It is pretty short for an elb, with a stiff non-working handle. Shorter flatbows have a wider thinner cross section, for good reason too. Making a heavy weight bow 66" with a stiff non-working handle is gonna cause undue stress on a thicker elb cross section, at least in my opinion, it would of been easier on the bow if you would of just made a typical flatbow with a flat cross section I would think. This is my two cents, . Thank you for sharing, I will go watch all the videos now, thanks for doing a build along even if it didn't end up with a working bow, I always enjoy buildalongs. Just take your time with the good one, over build it if your worried, definitely make it longer if you can and maybe a bit wider in cross section to battle set. If the stave is not to long, I would suggest making a full compass bow, and forgetting the non-working handle.

[mullet]

I'll give you a call.

[rockrush69]

Thanks everyone ... the new yew stave is longer . It is 72" and i got rid of the chunky handle and am following popes bow in the archery library . . It is not full compas . But it does bend in the handle . I actually did this one alot more mathimatical . And i have my finders crossed for tomorrows session of tilleri g . And i wont be putting it on the tree for a long time . I always did thT with flatbows and never had a prob . But i know now that yew ... and elb. Are nothi g like a vinemaPle or hickory or even ipe flatbow .... the reason for the mask is the first day i worked with the yew i got really dizzy and my chest hurt . It was very weird . I think i may be sensative to yew ... and i am trying to quit smoking actually . As i have asthma too . Lol .... any ways . I am posting new vids of the other stave as well and its progress although i wont be trying to show how to do it as much ... you can check those out on my page ... just click on my channel from the other vids . They will be there . I am also going to reduce so.e weight off of my vinemaple flatbow i just did a build along on too.  Cause it came out very nice 66" and 65# @ 26"  i think i want a nice 55# for that flTbow .

[toomanyknots]

Cool, will be following your build. Ya, I quit about 4 years ago or so. It was a great move. Even if you don't care about the health factor, say one pack a day, at 5 bucks, adds up to an extra 150 a month, which is nice. The only way to do it is just stop, all that gum and patches and crap is just that imo, crap. The first couple days is the hardest, you just gotta get used to not smoking all the time. You have to find stuff to do to keep your mind off smoking, and keep yourself busy. Making bows is a great candidate for that, . 

[Joec123able]

Hey your tiller seemed to be pretty freakin good but there's many other factors that coulda caused it and Ohh yea you really don't need the mask when your working outside the only time it wouldn't be a bad idea to wear it is if your working indoors. Pretty good series of videos too

[Bryce]

Saxon Pope gives good instructions on how to build "old horrible" in fact I used that chapter to build that bow. Tiller on the was a breeze if you get the thickness taper right.

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,40988.msg547817.html#msg547817

[Badger]

  I believe that bow was too narrow for the draw weight, considering the short length and stiff handle design. It didn't stand a chance.

[rockrush69]

Yes bryce pincone .... i am following saxon popes instructions on this other stave . I have it down to all the requiered dimensions from " old horrible , and am now going to start reducing the weight . He says in the reading that at those dimensions it would be around an 80# bow . I went to those dimensions with everything still square ... then took the corners off ( belly only ) and now i will file som temp knocks in . They will remain but wil recieve cow bone overlays once completed . For strength and longevity . I am posting all progress on my youtube channel .  Thanks for all the tips friends and please keep watching .

[Bryce]

Get a low brace on it early.