Practicing with knapped points

[Bugtussle]

How do y'all practice for hunting season with your knapped points?  I mounted 14 and bare shaft tested them into a foam cushion this weekend in an open field.... Lost one head, broke one shaft and loosen 3 addition heads that had to be re-glued (PPG).

When I hunt with steel I just practice with the broad heads and sharpen them when going hunting... But if I do that with these... They will be pretty beat up before deer season and will have seen better days...

However, I did identify four arrows that flew like darts and two that would probably be better as tomato stakes  ... The rest were lukewarm and I hope feathers will elevate their status to varmint getters...

I did a search and did not find anything related except for targets for stone heads so if this is a dead horse subject let me know  .

[PEARL DRUMS]

Bare shafting with broad heads can be very dangerous and costly. I suggest you bare shaft with field tips. I don't have your target answer, but I am curious to know myself as Im trying stone for the first time this season. Im 100% dedicated to it this time.

[Bugtussle]

I hear ya PD!  I had one arrow that dang near hit the target sideways!  Good thing I was in a 10 acre field (literally  ).  These are shoot arrrows and I spined them +/- 5lbs of one another and even identified the stiff side (typically I don't do that...) but it sure did take a toll on the broadheads...  My points are in the 60 grain neighborhood, do they even make glue on field points that small or did you make your own?

I am following the path of Billy and Twisted Limbs and using "legal" (7/8") bird points so I don't have a lot of room for re-sharpening.  Also, I wish you the best of luck in your pursuit for (I assume) a deer with a stonepoint this season!

[Bugtussle]

I found this topic (see below) but it addresses tuning rather than practice IMHO.  When I shoot metal heads, I practice with them a month prior to and during the season.  That way I know the set up intimately and have more confidence... typically I identify my "first string" arrow that always seems to fly true.  I even went so far one year to put a tick mark on each arrow, each time I hit the heart on the 3-D... even though the arrows were the same one or two always emerged as the "best"...


http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php

[Pat B]

I use a rubberized foam block I bought many years ago. A hay bale will work but you will have to push the arrow through it rather than pulling it out. If your stone heads loosened when you shot them you should secure them better. They shouldn't loosen with just one shot.
 You should sharpen the heads after shooting and before hunting with them. A little pressure flaking will get them back to where they should be. Maybe leave the last peak on either side of the back of the head at the at 7/8".

[PEARL DRUMS]

Pat would one shot into a layered foam target hurt the edge much you suppose? If I shoot it once and it flies I wont touch it again. I have no clue how to pressure flake. Not even a little idea!

[Pat B]

It should be OK after only one shot, Pearlie. I try to only shoot my stone heads once. If they fly well they are good to go. If not they are wallhangers! 

[Ryan_Gill_HuntPrimitive]

you can get 5/16 70 grain field points, taper your shafts down a little and they will fit fine.  do all your tuning with like grained field points. once the arrows are flying good, then mount your stone points, shoot them only once or twice into a soft foam target to ensure they fly good... if they dont fly good then spin test, or check your point weight. there shouldn't be any flight difference between field points and stone points.  as for a target, I like to use a styrafoam target from walmart.. once of those really cheap ones wrapped in plastic with the red white and blue bullseye's .. I have also made my own by purchasing a 4x8 sheet of 2" styrafoam from homedepot and cutting it in 2' x 2' squares and glueing them together at the corners with window caulk (that wont melt the foam)  and also wrapping the edges with duck tape to hold them together well.     in a truly primitive setting I would shoot into a sand bank, but they lightly touch up the cutting edge before hunting.      fwiw- I have been experimenting with different sized stone points on deer, and I still prefer 70-90 grains.  If you are shooting a lightweight bow, I would go with 7/8" 50-70 grain points.  I spend way more time on arrows each summer in anticipation for the fall's hunt than I have ever spent on the bow.  I have about 20 good cane arrows for my hunting bow, I am constantly adjusting them until I am super happy with perfect arrow flight. 2 weeks before season I will take the top 6-8 and mount my points on them, test once, put away, and next time they fly will be at a live animal.

[PEARL DRUMS]

Good info Ryan.

[TRACY]

I have three couch cushions- just the foam that I shoot into once I get an arrow done. I generally don't have to resharpen much and there's enough to keep from passing through. Jamie shared this tip in a previous post. You could sand which cardboard between the foam to slow them down also.


Tracy

[Bugtussle]

Great information!!  So the take away is get your arrows flying good with field points, practice with them till the season, put on your stone heads... Test, resharpen and put the best ones back for the hunt.  Is that accurate?

Pat - You are correct about the mounting of the heads.  I had to make the BH notches a little deeper and re-set the heads.  They seem to be a lot more secure.  They are not the prettiest by far but hopefully they will do the job.

Twisted - Excellent idea about the insulation foam board!  When the wind gets up around here, there pieces scattered everywhere.  BTW, I am shooting 600-700 grain arrows out of a 57 lbs bow.  You had mentioned that you are getting better results out of a little heavier head than my 60's, is that correct?  What type of increased performance are you seeing?

Tracy - I almost had three BIG couch cushions this weekend when the folks in my apartment building were moving out.  They had thrown out their couch besides the dumpster and by the time I had got back, the City had already hauled it off! 

Thanks guys for all the great feedback!

[Pat B]

Don't worry about how ugly it is. The deer that it goes through will never see it. 
 You should be sure that the transition between the shaft and head is gradual and smooth and that you have a good sinew wrap behind the head.
 My hunting arrows are between 550gr to 650gr with a few close to 700gr and my hunting bows are between 55# and 60#. At 15 yards it doesn't matter that much as long as the arrow shoots well for you and your hunting bow. We aren't shooting 300fps. Its more like 150fps to 175fps and at the slower speed a heavy arrow(weight forward)should tip toe through a deer before he knows it.

[Ryan_Gill_HuntPrimitive]

Great information!!  So the take away is get your arrows flying good with field points, practice with them till the season, put on your stone heads... Test, resharpen and put the best ones back for the hunt.  Is that accurate?


yup  you got it.

You are using a good poundage bow and nice heavy arrows, you should be just fine. the 60 gr points will work just fine. it doesn't take a whole lot of point to kill a deer as long as it goes through the lungs/heart.  It's just being able to have a compromise between width of the point and having a small enough point to get penetration if you hit ribs going in and out, or extra meat..etc...  lot of variables come into play when passing an arrow through a deer. For me the small points have gotten me consistently good penetration. Not that I haven't killed deer with larger points, but I haven't consistently gotten out both sides with a 90+ grain point.   With the poundage and arrow weight you are using, you have some elbow room on the size of your points.  here is what I do.. 

   I don't specifically make one grain/sized point. Instead I make whatever I think looks good.  my arrows also don't have all the same grain field point on them either.  In the tuning process, I will use 70 , 100 and 125 gr field points to see which ones fly the best. Once the arrows are tuned then I put the heavier points on the arrows with the heavier heads and the light little points on the lighter tipped arrows.  I use the diversity of weights to my advantage in tuning rather than a hindrance.  I see an article in the making here.  I might do an article here soon about tuning primitive arrows. of course it wouldn't run in the magazine for 6-12 months so, so you'll have to settle for my dis organized forum speak...lol

[Ryan_Gill_HuntPrimitive]

^^^^^ and apparently I still don't know how to use that quote button 

[Bugtussle]

Pat - Thanks for your vote of confidence my friend!!!  And I will pay particular attention to the transition...  Sometimes after seeing some of the incredible points made by the folks around here, I start to doubt the functionality of my points by their looks alone...  This may sound a little weird, but I get a sense of "satisfaction" when I accidentally slice myself open with a knapped point that I am making... It is almost like "positive" feedback that the point is a good one

Twisted - I appreciate the feedback and I definitely like your approach to matching up the heads and shafts!  And I think you should write an article since it is an unique perspective on tuning...  Also thanks for mentioning that you don't make just one size/weight type of point because my quiver looks like the "isle of misfits" but mine is because of lack of skill where yours are because of choice!