building a bow.. advice welcomed

[animus_divinus]

well, i should start by saying i really intend on retiring all my firearms for hunting and go solely bow for a while

as far as my background goes, i have a ton of experience working with wood, and have made numerous things in the past including musical instruments, so the tools and skills i have are certainly adequate

im actually looking to de-evolve my woodworking skills and stray away from power tools and get into using more hand tools for making bows and instruments, as well as other things i build here and there

so.. im looking to build a bow.. ive been trying to decide on whether i should go with a holmegaard flatbow, which is essentially a stone age tool. the same shape bow, but first made of laminating materials together, but ive also considered composite recurves like what the hungarians, huns, romans had.. however, i cant find ANY plans or information on that last one, so for the time being im going to skip it

i would like to make a bow using the simplest methods, using materials commonly found locally here in the united states, because of this im strongly leaning towards the holmegaard style flatbow using a 72 inch red oak stave.. i would like 55-65 pounds at a 28-30 inch pull.. i also completely intend to sinew back this with probably white-tail deer sinew, and then maybe cover that with something decorative, however thats not important.

the plans i have start off with a 5/8 inch thick stave, and the limbs taper to 5/16" at the nocks, i was wondering if these are suitable dimensions for a 55-65lb bow or if i would have to make the stave thicker prior to tillering and fine tuning the weight?

also, i was wondering if the sinew backing could be sanded down for a smooth surface for aesthetics without losing performance?... i intend to use hide glue for th is, as well as the riser since ive already retired my uses for modern synthetic glues and use only hide glue now on woodworking projects anyway

to be honest.. i didnt really think this holmegaard design was essentially stone age.. so im a bit torn between keeping this primitive with a leather grip, sinew string (im quite OK with flint arrowheads and natural feather arrows) or updating it with possibly a braided velvet or linen grip with linen string?...

anyway, those are all the questions im currently thinking of.. leaning towards the primitive red oak holmegaard style flatbow.. just wondering if the dimensions i mentioned would be thick enough for the draw im after and all that.

[George Tsoukalas]

I haven't used sinew much but know the bow is too long for it. The sinew will slow it down. I also never did  a Holmie but that may be a tough first build. Is this a board stave?  Anyway, here is my site. Jawge
http://georgeandjoni.home.comcast.net/~georgeandjoni/

[sailordad]

first off WELCOME TO PA 

use Georges web site,it will help immensly
yes 72" is to long for sinew,but a good length for a first bow

i would also check with your local hunting regs to make sure stone heads are legal before you go out hunting with them
not all states allow them.i cant hunt with them here in minnesota,but that dont keep me from making them.but our laws are very clear that "all broad heads must contain atleast 2 metal cutting edges"

just a little food for thought

[animus_divinus]

theres nothing in my local regulations about stone arrowheads, the only regulations involving the broadheads just state that i cannot use barbed arrowheads.. which is all fine as i would never use barbed anyway, makes it a PITA to remove them

so... sinew is too long for a 72" bow.. what sort of natural backing materials would you guys suggest to make a better bow thats widely available? besides other piece of wood?.. rawhide maybe?

another question... what about cutting flat pieces of deer antler to glue on both sides of the nock?.. would be nice to have a little extra support here, and i would like to use locally available natural materials.. and would a sinew bowstring still be appropriate? or is there another option while keeping accurate to the caveman technology?

[animus_divinus]

i forgot to answer the question of the wood.. i have a local lumber yard here that sells a variety of quartersawn hardwoods with the proper grain directions for making a bow.. red oak is one of them, seems to be a rather common bow material, and is also one of the most widely distributed hardwoods in north america, so all of these made it seem like the best choice.. i will be getting a red oak board and planing it perfectly smooth and squared off prior to cutting the shape of the bow

[toomanyknots]

"I haven't used sinew much but know the bow is too long for it. The sinew will slow it down. I also never did  a Holmie but that may be a tough first build. Is this a board stave?  Anyway, here is my site. Jawge"

"yes 72" is to long for sinew,but a good length for a first bow"

I have to disagree strongly. I've sinew backed bows around that length that pull 45# and shoot great. Without reflexing while sinewing. The bows were oval shaped instead of typical flatbows to be fair. But sinew will suit any length as long as you reflex the stave enough while sinewing to make sure that it does it's fair share of weight instead of just add weight. The longer the bow the more reflex you need to add. As 5" reflex on a shorter bow will stretch the sinew about as much as 10" reflex on a longer bow, generally speaking.

[Pat B]

If you have never built a bow I would suggest you read George's site and follow his directions for choosing wood and learning to tiller a wood bow. Once you get that worked out you can use that knowledge to build any sort of bow you fancy. One thing all of the varried styles of bows have in common is tillering. Without proper tillering skills none of these styles will preform as they should.
  It is easy to tie a short string between the tips of a stick. That "bow" will fling an arrow without any tillering at all. Making a bow that is efficient, durable and attractive is another story. Without tillering skills you won't be satisfied with the outcome.
  Wood bow building lends itself well to the use of hand tools. Most of us started building our first bows with nothing more than simple hand tools like a hand ax, draw knife, wood rasps, spoke shaves and cabinet scrapers.

[animus_divinus]

well, for this one ill probably use my bandsaw to cut the initial shape of the bow, then fine tune the shape with rasps, files, and planes, then on the next one ill see if i can get to that initial shape using simpler tools, like a hand ax

i know about tillering, already looked into all of that

and i guess what knot was saying is that for a longbow profile, sinew may not work, and i would have to turn the flatbow into a recurve for it to be worth adding sinew

that being said, ill skip on the sinew since i want this bow using the fewest tools as possible, and to recurve it i will either need to build a form and glue together laminations, or steam the wood and bend in a form to dry... either one of these i have the tools to do now, but i dont want to use them

so, ill have to find another backing material, linen or rawhide of either of these wont decrease the efficiency of the bow

[DEllis]

If you post some good pics of the board stave we could advise better, but there is a chance it does not need backing at all to become a durable bow.
Darcy

[animus_divinus]

its going to be a 4/4, 1 1/2" wide quartersawn red oak board 72 inches long, ill be going to the lumberyard in the near future to pick out a knot free piece with the best grain structure

the drawings i have begin at 5/8 thickness and taper to 5/16 thickness, this wont be enough to create a bow of the strength i need

so, i would need to decide what the best starting thickness would be, and what kind of taper i would need to get me a 55-65 pound bow, i doubt rawhide or linen backing would do it, so ill have to come up with another contour prior to tillering

[DEllis]

Straight lines on the board from one end to the other and it'll make an unbacked bow to 55# without too much trouble. It all depends on the tiller and the degree of fibre violation. 28 inch draw and 72 inches long, a good board will get you there. Best of luck.
Darcy

[animus_divinus]

so should i just cut the board to have straight 5/8 inch thick limbs and tiller from there to get the weight i want?.. or will i have to make them thicker than 5'8?

im also toying with the idea of a composite recurve of the common hungarian design, but its nearly impossible to find as much data on that as other bows, so im having a hard time finding a good tutorial or drawings

[Marc St Louis]

If your lumber yards has a selection of hardwoods then perhaps you would be best to look for another wood instead.  Hickory or Elm are a better choice for making your first bow and Hard Maple is also a good choice.  Be very picky about the wood you choose.

[animus_divinus]

IF i go with the holmegaard type, im going to go with wood thats commonly found around here.. red oak and maple are the only common hardwoods, hickory is hard to find, elm even harder

[animus_divinus]

well, i may go maple afterall, and im going to go with 2 inch wide limbs which taper into about a 1" wide limb, then tapers into the nock with that bit being round in cross section, then im free to work on the thickness of the bow limbs until i get the tillering i need and the weight and draw length i want, i probably wont use any backing

with this ill make some wooden arrow shafts, and use obsidian arrowheads which i will probably soak sinew in hide glue to attach the arrowheads