cracked first osage bow help wanted

[sander]

George thanks for trying to help out.  Is the area where I shaved the stave down in rhe
middle of the picture to get rid of the splinters where you see the three rings.  If there is a
ring violation under the glue and sinew patch are you saying it wont do the trick and only the
rawhide backing will work.  I would appreciate if you would elaborate.  The back was worked
5 or 6 years ago the early wood has turned dark and streaks much of the stave.  Rawhide
backing may be in the cards do you know a good source.  Thanks for your help.

[Dano]

I'd clean up that early wood, and be sure you didn't violate a ring. It looks like the rings are pretty thick from your last picture. If you don't have a goose neck scraper yet you can use a pocket knife.

[Jbell]

By the look of that last pic your back isn't cleaned up yet. Kind of hard to tell if you violated a ring or not becaouse of all the islands of earlywood left, all that should go. If you need some help I also live near St. Louis. Where are you located? I am on the illinois side.

[George Tsoukalas]

sander, there are violations (or islands) in the last picture that are above and below the patch. Look closely and hopefully you'll se them. To me they look like more than some early wood left on. That picture really shows them. You may not need a rawhide backing. That's up to you.  You have a really nice character laden stave there and I really want you to get a bow from it. .  The patch you put on will hold the cracked side and violations under it. I suggested the rawhide because you already had some difficulty with it and seem to have a hard time seeing ring violations. it's ok. I've been there too. I do feel that beginners  should back their first few for peace of mind. Sorry about the confusion. It's hard teaching over the computer like that.  Stay at it with questions until you see the violations (or islands as Jbell put it). BTW they looks pretty easy to clean up with a scraper. Now the crack. I'm wondering if you really needed to move those limbs with heat or if the string  would have fallen on the handle as is before the heat. leave nocks wide and handle full width until at least the first stringing and why not until full draw. The you can bring the string over without heat. I can elaborate if you want tomorrow. Time for bed now. :)Jawge

[sander]

Good to hear from you again Dano. Jbell I live in Eureka MO thanks for your offer.  I would lilke
to show you the bow I am trying to make.  I would really enjoy seeing your bows if you have
made some.  Where do you live in Illinois?  This stave came from your state I bought it from
a talented flintknapper.  George I know you have great experience and I value your advice.
Thanks for clearing up what you meant.  The stave has some bumps in it and goes from a high
narrow crown in places to sloping off sharply one direction and then the other on the limb in
question.  The rings though are nice and thick.  Using my cabinet scraper I didnt own a gooseneck
I would work through the early ring hit the shiny latewood and not attempt to get all the early
as I heard it doesnt' hurt to leave some.  I think the stave followed the ring pretty well.  Thats
the best I can tell.  I am leaning a bit toward backing it anyway I have watched it sit in the corner
for years, worked on it and put it back looking forward to getting a bow out of it. I don't want it
to break.  Wondering what the correct definition of a violated ring is all the way through, halfway?

[George Tsoukalas]

All the way through is a violated ring, Shredder. Yes, a curved scraping tool is almost essential. To, me those islands look more than just a little early wood. But you can see better than I can. You're probably younger with better eyesight. LOL. Jawge

[sander]

Hey George, thanks for clarifying the ring violation for me.  Well I don't know if you called
me shredder instead of sander on purpose but if the bow blows up on me I might start using
that name in your honor. LOL  I did try scraping a bit of the early wood with a knife as I was
considering that  you could all see a cleaned up back as I know some of you think there may be
ring violations.  Wondering if you could just use sandpaper on the earlywood I know its bad
for a scraper but if I am done with it what do you say. Sander

[Jbell]

Hey sander I live in Greenville Illinois. We are about an hour and a half apart. I sure could meet with ya sometime if you like. I am no expert but I have enough experience to help ya out.....hopefully Just let me know.

[Dano]

Hey Justin, do you know Ed Garrison, from Vandalia?

[GregB]

I hope the patch doesn't turn out to be just a practice experience. I was hoping you'd have enough wood to chase a ring full length on your bow. That would be the best route to go if you have enough wood left. If not, sinew backing it would probably be your next best option... a rawhide backing as a third. I don't think I would finish the bow without some sort of backing or you may find yourself with multiple patches if the bow doesn't completely give way first. I know you have a lot of time invested in the bow, even if it turns out lite-weight, that's better then it potentially breaking. Always more wood, and sounds like you have a fellow bowyer nearby for a second set of eyes and advice. That can be helpful...

[sander]

Jbell thanks again for your offer.  I would appreciate another set of eyes.  I would drive to your place or you could come to my house and I could take you to a place to archery hunt for deer
in the evening.  I use a compound for that. That could change in the future.  Greg I am not expecting this bow to be a screaming performer I think it is more osage sapwood not the real dark core wood and I realized too late you aren't supposed to draw it past its draw weight while tillering.  Right now there is less than an inch of set but when it was on the tillering tree and pulled 25" or so it came off with an inchor two more of deflex and then would go back to where it is now.  Some questions I know could be another whole thread is how long to keep it in my 97degree hot box to keep the moisture low while not getting dry.  I had it in there alot.  Also any harm in sanding off some earlywood I wouldguess not .  Any good sources for nice thin rawhide?  I have an idea on decorating the back I will keep to myself till I post the bow when done.  Its nice how you guys are willing to help a new guy.  Maybe I can return the favor someday.  Sander

[GregB]

Sander, I remove all the honey-comb looking winter growth that I can with a scraper lightly and then sand the back down really smooth. If you're planning to back the bow with something, then you may not want to sand as smoothly as you would if leaving the natural wood as the back. Especially with sinew where you might leave it rough for the glue to adhere to.

When we're working on a bow that is unsealed, during that timeframe of building it that may take several weeks, we leave it in a hot box or at a minimum over an airconditioner vent. All depends on how dry we think the wood is.

As for rawhide, you might get on the trading post section and see if anyone would be willing to trade you a piece.

[Jbell]

Hey Justin, do you know Ed Garrison, from Vandalia?

\
 I have heard of him. He is a glass bower right? I think he used to be my uncles neighbor in Hagerstown but I could be wrong.
 You come back and visit much?
 Sander, I am available evenings and sunday afternoons usually. Wife works weekends and I watch the kids, one being 7 months old.
Just let me know and ill shoot ya my address. I can show ya a bow or two also.

[sander]

Thanks for the info Greg.  Sounds good Jbell I have kids also.  Took  many of yours
advice and started cleaning up some earlywood and found I did have thin layers of latewood
on the back here and there.  This has all been a good learning experience thanks again.
You guys have some good eyes.  Jbell I have a Osage limb I was wondering if I could make a bow out of I will bring it when I visit you. I have to plan when.  Sander