Validity of Fl Paleo points

[Parnell]

Some years back I saw these magnificent points during the Silver River knap-in, which is coming up in February.  I saw these…famous, it seems, paleo-points on display while being properly guarded.   

Recently, I came across a perspective that these points are not original, but modern forged replicas.  There are ways to make the calcium deposits appear on a point, artificially.  Claims like this.  In their perfection, they certainly do not appear period correct, and I could see why questions of authenticity could be raised.

Well…who says what?  Whatcha guys think?  Valid…fakes?  Why?

[WhistlingBadger]

No idea, but they sure are pretty!   

[Hawkdancer]

I'm with WB!  A lot of work to make a fake, though!
Hawkdancer

[Outbackbob48]

Parnell, are you sure your not looking at the modern ones that may be signed on the other side . When I attened the knappin in Silver river they ask the knappers to donate a signed point to the musuem and are one display there, I actually have a point there someplace.  The first photo that you show of the red one sure looks like some flint that I have dug on Nethers farm while attending the fall Ridge knappin, Just wished mine looked as well as the ones your showing. I don't anything about calcium deposits. Not sure this is very helpful. Minus -11 deg. here this morning and sure wishing that I was headed for the Knappin coming up. Do they still have the Sop Choppy knapin the week after the silver river?  Bob

[Parnell]

They are beautiful, for sure.  Bob, yip, it’s my understanding that these are “the real deal”.  I think “Big Red” is listed in the Overstreet guide?  I’ve heard that this was found during construction excavation?  But, I am no expert.  Eddie knows more about the story, I think.  Let’s see what he has to say.

Oh, I’m not sure on the Sopchoppy event.  But, I’d be really surprised if it was shut down with modern circumstances down here!  Supposed to be in the low 80’s later this week.  Looking forward to some warmth!  Ha!

[White Falcon]

Dang those are good.

[Outbackbob48]

Steve, I think there is some mix up here, Big Red is a Cumberland style point and is red Jasper and according to Overstreet was found around Nashville , Tenn. The pics that your showing are Florida style points and they are real nice, just not Big Red Bob

[Allyn T]

Are those Newman points? They look fantastic

[mullet]

Steve, I know who found "Big Red" and know where it was found. It's documented and real. It is a Newnan as well as the other points pictured and are not Paleo but Archaic period blades.

 I have personally found a Paleo, chert, Bull Tongue Simpson while diving in the Peace River in Florida.

[mullet]

Also, all three blades are made from Agatized, heat treated coral and Steve is right, Big Red was found along the spoils bank during the construction of the Tampa/Hillsborough By-Pass Canal formally called Six Mile Creek. It was found by Carlos Tatum.

[Outbackbob48]

Hmmm, So what can ya tell us about the other one in Overstreets, the other big red an is a cumberland type. curious minds need to know,  :DBob

[Trapper Rob]

Nice points

[Outbackbob48]

Ed, Here is a little something that I just thought of. The Cumberland  big red is a Paleo and the Newman big red is Archaic. We know the Paleo is older by a few thousand yrs. So my question is who holds the title of big red or do they both claim the title of big red. Paleo or Archaic?  I guess I have been holed up to long because of deep snows, no fun trying to hike with 22" of snow cover on the ground, I sure am not going to find any type points, except on my tarp. Just a little pondering for ya on a nice winter evening.   Bob

[mullet]

I haven't seen the Cumberland Big Red, Bob, guess I'll try and look for it. But I would bet the Coral one is the big winner. Overstreet had it appraised for around 30-35 thousand dollars. I haven't heard what Carlos sold it for or what all three went for.

[mullet]

Big Red, the Newnan is in Overstreet's 13th edition, page 357 and according to Overstreet, " the finest Coral Newnan known, dubbed Big Red."
It is graded a G-10, $17,000- $30,000.