Tree bark as a belly material in 5-curve bows

[SLIMBOB]

I remember when the "Experts" wrote their well researched papers on the (I believe) "Iceman's" bows he carried, and those experts concluded that people from that particular time and era, built their bows "backwards" from what we today would consider as proper.  They tillered the backs of their bows.  It was science, written by the experts.  Experts that had never made a bow I would presume.  It didn't take a genius IQ to figure out something just wasn't right.

[PatM]

In fairness an experienced guy by our measures(Paul Comstock)  thought this was true as well.

[scp]

Tillering the back of the sapling stave is a perfectly reasonable way to make a decent bow. Using lighter materials on the bow wherever possible is not a bad way to make a fast bow. Our meager understanding of the natural materials cannot compare with the thousands of years of experience of people who lived with their bows as we live with our cell phones. We are the ones who talk about Perry reflex when the pre-stressed glued reflexing was practiced for hundreds of years, if not thousands of years.

[PatM]

Is bark stiff enough to logically create additional stiffness to the limb?

Possibly, especially if bound to an oak stave and encased with tendon.

 But if  the bark is not stiff and tendon isn't either, could this be true?

[scp]

Is bark stiff enough to logically create additional stiffness to the limb?

Possibly, especially if bound to an oak stave and encased with tendon.

But if  the bark is not stiff and tendon isn't either, could this be true?

Cured glue is very stiff, especially when it is attached to long fibers.

[simk]

It might work if you use nails instead of glue to affix the bark to the belly of the bow...

[AndrewS]

Gluing wood laminates together is a popular technique in bow making.
The finds of Scytian bows show that these bows were partly made of wood only (laminated), partly covered with sinew and/or also wrapped, partly sinew-covered and hornfaced.
The bows presented in the article were all without hornfacing.

The one bow found was made of wood laminated (oak and fruit tree) and covered with sinew and wrapped with sinew.
Belly facing (under the sinew wrapping) was found to be fruit tree bark.
Was the belly facing possibly a laminate of fruit tree incl. bark?
If I took bamboo as belly for such a bow, I would also have the outermost layer of bamboo as bow belly but bamboo as grass has no bark....
In which way the bark was used (around the tree or along the tree (from root to crown)) is not written so the fiber direction is not clear....

[PatM]

Is bark stiff enough to logically create additional stiffness to the limb?

Possibly, especially if bound to an oak stave and encased with tendon.

But if  the bark is not stiff and tendon isn't either, could this be true?

Cured glue is very stiff, especially when it is attached to long fibers.

    Try bending a sinew and glue matrix strip.

[scp]

    Try bending a sinew and glue matrix strip.

When they are bound to a relatively thin oak stave?
That's what my experiment several posts above is all about.

[Jim Davis]

Hanibal Lecter's profile is on wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannibal_Lecter

Now you know what's in the pots he stirs.

[PatM]

    Try bending a sinew and glue matrix strip.

When they are bound to a relatively thin oak stave?
That's what my experiment several posts above is all about.

 Why not just experiment with that then?    Sinew does not stiffen a slat much.

[scp]

    Try bending a sinew and glue matrix strip.

When they are bound to a relatively thin oak stave?
That's what my experiment several posts above is all about.

 Why not just experiment with that then?    Sinew does not stiffen a slat much.

That's the first step with just glue, no sinew involved. Next step would be wrapping the whole thing with tendon. Even a flimsy material can have plenty of compressive strength if it is wrapped tightly together with a stiff material. If sinew is used, it is even possible that sinew's tensile strength is used in the compression of the belly.

Main idea is that tree bark is a lot lighter than oak wood. That's why many all fiberglass bows are replaced with wooden core ones.

[PatM]

Tensile strength used in compression?  Can you pull and push a rope at the same time?

[scp]

Tensile strength used in compression?  Can you pull and push a rope at the same time?

Have you ever tried to rupture a balloon by compressing it?

[Jim Davis]

OK, since y'all are not inclined to follow a link when you could just keep on arguing, here is the gist of Hanibal Lecter.

From Wikipedia:

Dr. Hannibal Lecter is a character created by novelist Thomas Harris. Lecter is a serial killer who eats his victims. Before his capture, he was a respected forensic psychiatrist; after his incarceration, he is consulted by FBI agents Clarice Starling and Will Graham to help them find other serial killers.

Lecter first appeared in a small role as a villain in Harris's 1981 thriller novel Red Dragon. The novel was adapted into the film Manhunter (1986), with Brian Cox as Lecter. Lecter had a larger role in The Silence of the Lambs