Author Topic: reworking an osage bow advise (recurved pic added)  (Read 6034 times)

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Offline Selfbowman

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2017, 02:58:45 pm »
What is your draw length and the bow is 63" with a stiff handle.  How wide are your limbs?  Maybe flip the ends 1-1/2" in the last 9-10" . It might pull out . I am not sure about that. Looks like they are bending a bit now. Arvin
Well I'll say!!  Osage is king!!

Offline Selfbowman

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise
« Reply #16 on: March 10, 2017, 03:08:47 pm »
What is that string made from. It looks like about 16 strands of B50. If you make a 8 strand D97 string , pad the loops and serving to 10 strand , use 030 serving you should increase your cast and reduce the shock a lot. You can take off 1/2your silencers which will also at to your cast. Arvin
Well I'll say!!  Osage is king!!

Offline bradsmith2010

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise
« Reply #17 on: March 10, 2017, 03:16:35 pm »
arvin, I did not shoot fast flight,, just made projection on what it might have done, I did gain speed with the b 50


Offline Selfbowman

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise
« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2017, 03:29:23 pm »
Ok Brad understood about the B50. I argued with Rick Barby for about a year and a half. I finally bought some D97 . He was right!! O:) That's all I use now. Using 1/8-1/4 " wide Osage over lays and not having wood damage from string yet. The results I mentioned happened. You might say this is the second time I have had to eat crow on the Internet about string anyway. B50 works by the way that's all I used for 5-7 years.  :BB Arvin
Well I'll say!!  Osage is king!!

Offline bradsmith2010

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2017, 03:46:47 pm »
yes I still shoot the b 50,,, but sometimes I test with fast flight just so I know what it will do for my own records,, all my hunting bows are b 50,, cause I like the feel of the thicker string,, well one bow has a fast flight,, whatever works best for you,, back then I did not shoot much fast flight ,, or just didnt have any,, and was not really aware of how much difference there is in an 8 strand fast flight and a 16 strand b 50,,,
as far as cast of the bow,,

Offline LeightonM

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2017, 07:21:25 pm »
What is your draw length and the bow is 63" with a stiff handle.  How wide are your limbs?  Maybe flip the ends 1-1/2" in the last 9-10" . It might pull out . I am not sure about that. Looks like they are bending a bit now. Arvin

My draw is 26. And the limbs are 1 3-8"

Offline Selfbowman

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise
« Reply #21 on: March 10, 2017, 09:45:01 pm »
How about mid limb? You might just try the string thing before you change the bow limbs . Looks like it was built by someone that understood bow design. Could have been a bit green . Lots of variables when it comes to wood. Is the limb sectional rectangular D shaped or a mix of both?  You asked.  ;D 
Watch it or you will be chasing rabbits like me.  :BB  It's a wonderful ride this bowing stuff. Arvin
Well I'll say!!  Osage is king!!

Offline LeightonM

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise (recurved pic added)
« Reply #22 on: March 14, 2017, 08:08:35 pm »
How long should I let the moisture return till I start to bend and tiller it?

Offline bradsmith2010

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise (recurved pic added)
« Reply #23 on: March 15, 2017, 01:13:35 pm »
hey,, nice job on the recurves,,

Offline joachimM

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise
« Reply #24 on: March 15, 2017, 04:37:06 pm »
OK, heres a radical idea hehehe! Reverse it and sinew it up!

I like the way you think, Dubois!


Offline PatM

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise
« Reply #25 on: March 15, 2017, 07:14:20 pm »
Brad you keep a lot better  records than I do . But that info was good. Brad the fast flight was probably half or more of the speed change. Arvin
He didn't actually use ff...

Offline Springbuck

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise (recurved pic added)
« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2017, 02:11:09 pm »
 "Flipping the tips will add more stress so unless you get the rest of the limb contributing you may only add more set."

Maybe.  Usually.  But, maybe not.

I do what you did here almost as a matter of routine.  I let whitewood flatbows take whatever set they are going to, while keeping it as low as possible, of course.  That's usually ABOUT 1" to 1-1/2" for a 68" bow.  I've never been able to get much less from common woods, but, I can't stand it!!!!  So, along with a final heat tempering, I almost always end up flipping the tips just about that much back, so the tips end even or, like 1/2" back.  For me, this works really well and I have almost not issues.

First, since the tips were stiff in the last 8" anyway, the net effect on strain seems to be pretty minimal, and I get very little new set, if any.  It does raise draw weight often 5-10lbs, but again, that seems to not contribute any more set.  And, I know this is counter-intuitive, but it just doesn't seem to bug it much.  The one thing it really does is tighten up the string at brace, so even if I re-tiller to the same weight, the bow is a little snappier.

Now, on your bow here, it does look like much of your set was taken in the inner limbs.  Recurving it like you did (more than I usually "flip" the tips) actually shifts the limb tip leverage AWAY from the inner limbs out toward the middles and to just below the recurve.  If you string it as is, you will see those areas belly out more than they do in the "before " pic.  So, you may take more set there, but maybe not where the wood already had.  That's what I'd expect.

Either way, despite the experience others are reporting, I usually have to barely tweak tiller, if at all, as long as I don't go nuts on the size and angle of the recurves.  The main problem I do have is that the limb tips are usually skinny enough that I can't get away with much curve or they try to lean to the side.

Give it a few days, string it and have a look.

Offline LeightonM

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise (recurved pic added)
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2017, 08:43:05 pm »
Thanks for that springbuck! I'm looking forward to working on this and seeing what it becomes!

Offline Springbuck

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise (recurved pic added)
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2017, 12:23:50 pm »
Good luck. 

See, if I had seen your "after" picture with the recurves, and you had done that profile to begin with on purpose, that would be a really cool and pretty bow. 

We pay a lot of attention today to set and the wood degradation it causes.  It DOES affect the wood, and that does affect performance negatively, and shouldn't be ignored.  BUT, Baker et al addressed this a LOT of times in the TBB's, and geometry, especially side profile still seems to be just as or more important.

For instance, in the Design and Performance chapter of TBB I, Baker says that recurves are faster than straight bows because they have better F/D curves, but in the Design and Performance Revisited chapter in TBB IV, he corrects himself  emphatically, and talks about the benefits of reducing outer limb weight on longer bows to raise efficiency.

BUT, (depending on everything else, of course) a deflex/recurve of that length will shoot better than a straight limbed bow that length with 3-plus inches of set, despite the overworked inner limbs.

Offline LeightonM

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Re: reworking an osage bow advise (recurved pic added)
« Reply #29 on: March 17, 2017, 09:03:44 pm »
You were right SpringBuck, I was working on this bow today and it needed almost no retillering. I got it to full draw and shot it a little with little to no new set. I gained 8 pounds of draw and it shoots sweet and faster. The only thing i need to do yet is align the tips better, they aren't very lined up with the handle.