Best design for 38-40" draw length?

[Marc St Louis]

I don't know if you have any interest in hard backings but the bow in this thread here http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,58509.0.html is 61" long.  It's tillered to 28" but I know it would go to 30".  If you add 10" to the length I'm sure it would handle at least a 38" draw.

[Badger]

Mark, I think something like that would work very well, love that design.

[paco664]

just a question... what kind of reaction did you have to the osage?

from what you said it was quite strong and harmful...

[willie]

I was thinking that a lighter wood would work well in this application, but could not reason just why.  Maybe just a subjective inkling from building underweight bows? I am glad Steve made this suggestion.

[make-n-break]

Badger, I've got some really dense Douglas Fir that spines at 80+ at 23/64 diameter. If I turn him a few real long shafts with those numbers, you think the deflection would be acceptable?

[Badger]

  I would be curious what the doug fir weighs at 3/8, he will need more than 100# spine and weight should be no more than about 500 grains bareshaft.

[Marc St Louis]

The shafts are going to be heavy by themselves so if they are tapered and a light point used then a more reasonable spine could be used

[loon]

Pine? If going with wood, Saami bows look slightly like Manchu, I would maybe look into that.. Should shoot faster than the gigantic horn bows with lighter/medium arrows, I think. Especially at a lighter draw...



^ Those are from Ivar (Kviljo)
He basically said compression wood from a crooked trunk backed with something like birch, hazel or maple would work well.

Man, I wish I had a lot of free time and ability to just fell pine trees or something. Then I would definitely like to try to make a 80" Saami style bow with a 39" draw length. Wonder if I could draw that long with Kyudo technique.. Hmm, maybe ERC boards could be used instead of pine, like Marc just did!

If you shoot with a high (straight) wrist like Japanese archers, you could maybe try a low (collapsed) wrist like Korean archers do to get a few inches less draw with the same 'anchor'

[EdwardS]

My reaction to osage is respiratory distress and unconsciousness.  Had to go to hospital, IV steroids and hours on oxygen from cutting and shaping a thumbring from it.  My osage bow has a leather handle and is coated in poly and I still get red hands if I'm sweaty when I touch it.  I should note that I've got pretty bad lung damage from Marfan so I'm not normal. 

These are interesting options.  As I understand, there are two ways to effect a long draw-either a longer bow or a design that keeps the string from popping off at that draw length.  A yumi is an example of the first, and the Manchu bow the second.  Both have their merits.  The longer the bow, the simpler the materials can be, but finding good materials that long is always a crapshoot.  The other way is a more complex bow, but can be assembled from wood of more manageable lengths.  Six of one, a half dozen of another.  I'm trying to feel out my options before I go cutting any wood.

I'm hoping to get this out next year to hunt.  This is not a weekend project to me.  I want to do this right.

[PatM]

A simple wood and sinew modified "Manchu" could be made to withstand a draw of that length without getting into ridiculous bow length. Especially since your draw weight demands are not great.
   

[loon]

A simple wood and sinew modified "Manchu" could be made to withstand a draw of that length without getting into ridiculous bow length. Especially since your draw weight demands are not great.
 

What woods are best for sinewing, though? And resistant to chrysalling and breaking?

[PatM]

Yew, Elm, Red Cedar, HHB.

[loon]

i wonder what draw length a sinewed ERC 'saami' shaped bow could take, if it was, say, 68" long? maybe with red oak tips spliced on. wonder if they always had the limbs like an english longbow, all thick and narrow, or if they ever had narrower handles but wider, thinner limbs. but maybe the latter design would allow for more d/l from a shorter overall length?
would ERC give that allergic reaction?

Maybe it could be asymmetric? But then it'd hit roofs and branches more. heck, shooting in my garage i have problems even with a 55" symmetric bow hitting the roof... I have to shoot longer bows sitting down

[willie]

loon

the sami used compression pine in the bellies, which does not chrysal easily.
the elb like limbs may have been ok for that belly wood, but if you propose to substitute with another, then design accordingly

[PatM]

i wonder what draw length a sinewed ERC 'saami' shaped bow could take, if it was, say, 68" long? maybe with red oak tips spliced on. wonder if they always had the limbs like an english longbow, all thick and narrow, or if they ever had narrower handles but wider, thinner limbs. but maybe the latter design would allow for more d/l from a shorter overall length?
would ERC give that allergic reaction?

Maybe it could be asymmetric? But then it'd hit roofs and branches more. heck, shooting in my garage i have problems even with a 55" symmetric bow hitting the roof... I have to shoot longer bows sitting down

 If you switch from specifically Saami to "Northern Eurasian" you'll find many bows with that wider limb narrow handle style.