tree i.d. help please?

[Ruddy Darter]

I had a look over the local copse and came across some nice and fairly clean straight logs laying in a pile left to rot. Probably cut in early spring or late summer(maybe recently) by the council so possibly not ideal. They range from six foot to about ten plus foot and average 5-6" diameter. , I got a pic of the best leaf that was still attatched.
I'm a little embarrassed by my tree recognition knowledge but I think elm or wych elm?, thanks if someone could enlighten me further, and suitable for heavy elbs or other bow types? Worth grabbing? There's more than I can handle over there.


  Ruddy Darter.

[Springbuck]

  I really can't ID it for you, but the wood doesn't look too bad.   Usually downed wood you didn't cut yourself isn't a great option, but that stuff looks pretty clean. Try to pick the best stuff lying up off the ground and check under the bark for signs of serious insect infestation.  Then maybe split it up and have a deeper look.  Maybe slice off a long chunk and see how it acts once you quick-dry it as far as what it weighs, how it bends, and how it breaks.

[Ruddy Darter]

Thanks Springbuck, I gave them a glance over and seemed o.k., the one I picked up I gave a few taps and gave a nice ring and vibration back so seems rot free first impression.
I'll get back over there in a day or two and grab a couple and split it. I'd like to be certain of what wood it is though.


  Ruddy Darter.

[caveman2533]

Looks like hornbeam to me but I am an amateur wood detective

[Ruddy Darter]

Thanks caveman2533, just had a look and hornbeam leaves look similar, also I looked up hazel and I think the leaves match, and they also said it was often confused with elm, I think I'll put my money on hazel, not sure though,
If it's one of these two then maybe better suited for flatbows (?).
  Ruddy Darter.

[Pat B]

Where do you live?  That will help with the ID. My first thought when I saw the leaf was hawthorn(Crataegus) but it's is hard to tell from the pics. Many hawthorns have spiky thorns along the small branches. Try to get a close-up pic of the branch tips with the buds and as close as you can showing the characteristics of the buds; overall shape, bud scales and even last years bud scars. That would be one of the best ID methods you can use this time of year besides the leaf.
 Insect damage wouldn't necessarily be the problem. Even if you don't see rot, fungi will be all through the wood if it has been on the ground for long, as little as a few weeks. Get the wood split and in the dry so it can begin to dehydrate. Fungi needs moisture. After it is dry you can do a test on a small piece to see if it is sound. Then I'd make a regular weight bow before building a heavy weight bow with this wood. 

[wizardgoat]

Looks like Hazel to me, but hazel deteriorates very quickly once it's downed

[Ruddy Darter]

Thanks Pat B, I don't think it's hawthorn and there wasn't much foilage left to see, I know the hawthorn around here and  I've cut some of that before, I'm thinking hazel, it grows a lot round here and is used frequently for coppicing, just haven't seen any this big before.
O.k., thanks wizardgoat , I'm thinking I might just grab a log and see how it works for arrow shafts and for some carving wood.

  Ruddy Darter.

[crooketarrow]

 HAZLE Had to tell from your pic's.

 Do you have wood boarers any dieing or dead wood is covered up in boarers after their cut.

  P;us if it's been layingon the ground it's already started to decay.

  Always do your own cutting or know when it's being cut. Then you do your part and store it in the shade out of the weather.

  Take one debark it and see if you have wood boarers or if rots started. I've made a few bows where the wood boarers only went down to the hard wood. And only went that far down.

  All hard woods boarers do this.

  I spray all logs after I cut them. Again after I split into staves. And again in a few months. Here in WV. we have wood boarers really good. But spraying them like this. I hav'nt had a problem with boarers in years.

  Any pestaside from lowes will work.

[Ruddy Darter]

Thanks a lot crooketarrow, that's very helpful information... I won't bother with this lot and I'll hold off till January and look for something to cut although you have to be careful around here for legal reasons, I'll just grab a piece for carving and see how it is for arrow shafts. Many thanks all, glad I asked. 
(I'm Berkshire U.K. by the way Pat B)
  Ruddy Darter.

[Del the cat]

Bark looks like Hazel, rings look a tad well defined for Hazel., Leaf looks like Hazel.
Split it and see... any grey/blue or porous looking wood and it's prob starting to rot, Hazel is white, rings are hard to see, firm and clean to work. Bark is thin, can look like shiny gun metal or have some flakey outer stuff.
Here's some in the tree:- 
http://bowyersdiary.blogspot.co.uk/2010/08/hazel-harvesting.html
Del

[Ruddy Darter]

Thanks Del, I think hazel, maybe the rings show more because its been down for a while, I'm going to hold off for a stave of something for my first self bow from scratch, with the mild damp weather we've been having too maybe asking for trouble if it's been down for a while, I don't really want to chance or complicate the issue on my first venture. I swear enough as it is . But for some carving wood seems cool, if its spalted some even better. 
Useful and important information learned from this post, thanks again one and all.

  Ruddy Darter.

[Del the cat]

Hazel can fast season in a month (on a warm radiator with ends painted... the wood not the rad' ) and just have a play.
You'll know if it's English Hornbeam as it's hard as hell to saw through, whereas Hazel works like a mature cheddar
Del

[Ruddy Darter]

Thanks again Del, I'll definitely grab some for carving then if it seasons quickly, I'll also find out what one it is then, mature cheddar or chhurpi, 
 I did see this one while over there, its a branch/tree growing from a fallen old yew, might chance nabbing that. My foots in the bottom of the first pic for scale.

   Ruddy Darter.

[wizardgoat]

Looks like a nice yew pole. I love fallen over big yews, they're usually still alive and the branches shoot up nice and straight.