We are staring an International Primitive Flight Shooting Federation

[WillS]

There's no baggage Ian.  None of what I said is related to the ewbs.

Many of the MR bows have two nocks on the upper limb.  Common sense would suggest they're for stringers, no?

There's no evidence for full nocks on bows of the period, unless I've forgotten any?  If there are then that changes the issue of course, but if the Warbow class of the new federation is to be based around MR bows, which all had side nocks, why use anything else?  Seems odd to enforce a rule that makes bows fit exacting MR dimensions and not to use MR nock types?

Like I said, indigenous can be altered.  I was going by the Welsh class idea, as a rough start.

[PatM]

That's why I like the EWBS arrow class. At least you can agree on the arrows.

[outcaste]

Hi,

Both Jeremy (yeomanbowman) and I have shot under the FITA rules, and although there are specs governing bow, weight class and to some degree arrow design, the basic premise is whom can shoot the furthest. By all means create a robust bow spec that takes into account the working properties of wood types and contextual references, but you could leave the arrow design to the discretion of the archer.

Alistair

[Badger]

     Another possible opton would be not to create a war bow class in the new organization and any war bows wishing to compete would simply compete as unlimited draw weight english long bows shooting at a specified grains per pound, somehwere between 7 and 10 grains per pound is what we are discussing.

[adb]

     Another possible opton would be not to create a war bow class in the new organization and any war bows wishing to compete would simply compete as unlimited draw weight english long bows shooting at a specified grains per pound, somehwere between 7 and 10 grains per pound is what we are discussing.

 

There yah go. That sounds reasonable.

If, for example, you're shooting a 100# EWB, and you specify 10 grains per pound arrow weight, that would be a 65 gram arrow. Very reasonable. That's very close to a Livery spec arrow, currently being used in the warbow societies now. This philosophy would level the playing field a bit more, as more draw weight would require a heavier arrow.

Would there be requirements for fletching and head sizes, etc? Without the heavy heads and long fletchings, you could certainly get much more distance.

With a current WBS livery spec arrow and a 100# bow, I can get 200 yards on a good day. I think with more of a "flight" arrow (minimal fletching, barrel tapered, light head, etc.), you could get much more... likely closer to 300 yards maybe.

[Del the cat]

     Another possible opton would be not to create a war bow class in the new organization and any war bows wishing to compete would simply compete as unlimited draw weight english long bows shooting at a specified grains per pound, somehwere between 7 and 10 grains per pound is what we are discussing.

I think that may be the easiest option as the warbow community will then have a choice of shooting with their own societies and rules and/or shooting in this Federation.
It may also avoid the endless pedantic dicussions which seem to me to be a feature of the warbow fraternity.
Alternatively, an extra class of longbow 100#and over?
Del

[Badger]

 Del, lets just go with that idea, much simpler and we will still get the desired effect.

[Del the cat]

Del, lets just go with that idea, much simpler and we will still get the desired effect.

Excellent, can't beat a bit of executive decision making.
Del

[Yeomanbowman]

Adding a 5/8 rule for clarity may be a good idea.

Sorry, I joined this one late.

Del, Bow X1-3 is outside of this in places.  It occures just before the parallel width tapers, which is what I find well designed mean wood bows tend to do.

[Yeomanbowman]

So Badger,
what's the upshot?

[meanewood]

This topic seems to be raising lots of hotly debated issues discused on other threads.

The first thing to establish is, is the proposed class for Warbows -  Medieval and Tudor or just Tudor or just Mary Rose Tudor or Mary Rose Tudor excepting bow X1-3.

As soon as you start to set guidelines, you start ruling out bows and arrows that we know existed!

For example : If you were to apply the ewbs livery arrow specs to the actual arrows found on the Mary Rose, the vast majority would be rejected for being to short!

Another example would be if you start insisting on horn nocks, you rule out any meanewood bows made with self nocks.
The Luttrell Psalter clearly shows a bow with self nocks.


I think It would be a good idea to get a warbow class for flight shooting but for gods sake don't get Warbow guys to come up with the guidelines, we are experts in arguing about our passion!

[Yeomanbowman]

I think It would be a good idea to get a warbow class for flight shooting but for gods sake don't get Warbow guys to come up with the guidelines, we are experts in arguing about our passion!

[brian]

 i thought the main purpose  of the   heavy bow  [war bow] was to hit what you were aiming at, iam sure the medieval didnt get his knickers in a twist  worrying  about  how far his arrow went as long as it found its mark .

[adb]

i thought the main purpose  of the   heavy bow  [war bow] was to hit what you were aiming at, iam sure the medieval didnt get his knickers in a twist  worrying  about  how far his arrow went as long as it found its mark .

No, not really. Warbows in period were massed volley weapons at distance. Medieval artillery, if you will. 5000 archers (as at Azincourt) with a sustained mass volley of 8-10 arrows/minute/archer was a devastating weapon. That's 40,000-45,000 arrows/minute. Some of the arrows found their mark. Accuracy was more vital at close range (<50 yards). Knowing the distance at which you could make contact with your enemy would have been vital. Why bother wasting expensive arrows, if they were too far away? Archers in period were expected to attain certain minimum standards to make muster. Distance was one of them.

I have seen it done, but I have never hit the mark at 200 yards with a warbow. Within a foot, but never actually hitting the target.

[DC]

If they missed by more than a foot, they hit the next guy. It's all good.