Author Topic: Need advice on increasing draw strength  (Read 8674 times)

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Offline Badger

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Need advice on increasing draw strength
« on: September 10, 2013, 02:49:31 pm »
   I started excercising with a slight heavier bow today trying to increase my strength. I noticed the only muscles getting pumped up are the ones on the top of my shoulders and neck and not my back muscles. I feel like my alignment must be off and not incorporating those muscles. I did notice I was shrugging my shoulders as I drew. Any advice on how to attain proper alignment so my back muscles play a larger roll in the draw. 65# is the absolute most I can draw to 28" right now and I really need to get to 80#. I have one year.

Offline wood_bandit99

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2013, 06:34:13 pm »
I would work on pulling it to the pec height then raising to ear or face or wherever u anchor. I only pull 55# maybe more if I was going for weight. Not bad for a 14 year old :) that is how I exercise them
Yew and osage, BEST. WOODS. EVER! Shoot straight my friends!!!

Offline WillS

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2013, 07:06:34 pm »
A year is a good amount of time to work out a program for yourself.  A lot of the heavy-weight warbow guys use trainers they make themselves, from bungee cords or springs.

Working up through the weights using actual bows is fine, but at some point you need to keep getting your hands on bigger bows which can often be tricky.  I would recommend making yourself a bow trainer, with a load of bungee cords tied to a wooden grip which is held in the bow hand.  Use a tiller to work out and adjust the cords until they're at neat increments, for example 50#, 60#, 70# and 80#.  Warm up going through the weights gradually, holding the grip in the left hand and "drawing" the bungee cord with the right, and make sure that you're feeling the muscles work where you want - lower shoulders, bow arm tricep etc.  Once you reach the 80# bungee, you should be nicely warmed up and be able to do at least a couple of repetitions, really feeling the muscles working and being confident that you're not straining or working the wrong parts of your body.

With a year in which to achieve it, you can go real slow, taking care of your body and not going up until you feel it getting easy at one weight.  And although it sounds obvious and cliché, doing press ups and most importantly pull ups/chin ups is a fantastic way of increasing the right muscle areas without needing equipment.  Study videos and images of guys using heavier bows as it's a very different technique to target shooting or hunting. 

Hope this helps a little bit!

Offline Badger

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2013, 07:56:23 pm »
  I haven't pulled 80# for many years, at 55 yrs old I could still pull 70#, 65 now and noticeabley have lost some strength. The main thing I am concerned with is that I don't feel like I am using the back muscles and for some reason I can't seem to find the right angle to involve them. I am assuming I would feel soreness in them if I was using them. I always thought pulling with my elbow level to my shoulder would automaticaly involve the back muscles but I feel nothing in them after a hard bow workout.

Offline adb

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2013, 07:59:58 pm »
Hey, Steve
I'm 50 and still shooting warbows. I don't work out, I'm not all muscley. I have been shooting bows all my life, however. My point is, if I can do it, so can you!

Because a picture speaks a thousand words, I'm going to post a sequence of pics of me drawing my 100# warbow to full draw (in this case 31").
« Last Edit: September 10, 2013, 08:09:03 pm by adb »

Offline adb

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2013, 08:03:27 pm »
The rest...
« Last Edit: September 10, 2013, 08:08:46 pm by adb »

Offline adb

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2013, 08:07:07 pm »
And it's gone...

As far as strength training goes... I just shoot. No bungees, no trainers... just shooting. When I shoot like this, all I can feel are my back muscles. I'll shoot 50-60 arrows a session with this bow, and I can't feel my arms or shoulders getting tired at all. My back muscles feel very engaged and pumped full of blood while I'm shooting.

As far as what I'm thinking about during shooting...

Wide stance, bow up, start to draw, pull through to my right shoulder (not thinking about pulling to my face at all like a normal draw), load up the weight on to my back leg, pull all the way through past my chest, squeeze my shoulder blades together, open my chest to get the last inch of draw, release and shift my weight forward onto my front leg, follow through.

See how my drawing arm (elbow) and the arrow are in alignment throughout the entire draw? That's how I engage my back muscles.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2013, 08:20:36 pm by adb »

Offline Badger

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2013, 08:29:45 pm »
  Good pictures, The big difference I see is my foot placement and using my weight. I will also try to conciously try and squeeze my shoulder blades together. I have always had a strong well developed back but for some reason I just am not using it.

Offline Badger

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2013, 01:30:22 pm »
   I went to a lighter bow this morning and did 50 reps drawing to about 30". I did notice some pump in my back muscles this time. I think maybe the heavier bow is throwing me too far out of form and hunching my shoulders. Maybe a lot of reps with the lighter bow and watching my form might help and work up a bit more gradual. The lighter bow is like 56#@30". If I can just add 2# or 3# per month I will have it.

Offline adb

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2013, 02:46:35 pm »
Yup... keep your shoulders down. I see a lot of people hunching up their shoulders if the bow is a bit heavy. This is exactly what you shouldn't do. I think about drawing back to my shoulder, not my face. That way, I'm not able to hunch up my shoulders.

Offline Badger

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2013, 01:40:03 am »
   I discovered something today, I think it is my bow arm that is weak and not my pulling arm. I switched hands and drew left handed and could draw 80# easily. About 20 year ago I had neck surgery for a piched nerve in my neck that had paralized a good part of my left arm, mostly the tricep and parts of my hand. After surgery the feeling came back and the muscle came back but it never regained full strength. I might just have to learn to shoot left handed if I can't build it back up.

mikekeswick

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #11 on: September 12, 2013, 02:43:03 am »
I was going to say that it is also very important to train left handed as well.
Injuries generally happen when there are muscle imbalances. I do a lot of rock climbing and know only too well about training the antagonists and doing things opposite to normal so not only certain muscles get better.
Also most people don't seem to know this but when you start doing something new (heavier bow) then the muscles involved DON'T actually get stronger for a long time all that happens is your brain basically gets wired up better! Eg. the muscle you already have actually just starts working and the neurological conections to that muscle 'wake up'. So be posistive and keep in mind that it's all there you just have to awaken it.

Offline Del the cat

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #12 on: September 12, 2013, 04:00:03 am »
I reckon my 'leaning back into an open doorway' exercise is pretty good.
Elbows out pressing against the door frame, lean back, shuffle the feet* forward a foot or two then lever yourself forward and back by using yourback muscles. You can really feel it working the right groups of muscles. It's a bit awkward, but in some ways thats good because it make you do it in a slow controlled manner.
The equipment involved is readilly available and cheap too...just don't try clapping half way through ::)
Del
Obviously beware of slippy floors, inappropriate footware etc.
Please sign the attached disclaimer before attempting this at home.  ;)
Health warning, these posts may contain traces of nut.

Offline Goose Fletch

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2013, 01:56:45 pm »
adb, just shooting bows is one way that  will indeed help you pull back heavier bows as your progress though your archery ..umm..career...for want of a better term. however, in the case of warbow archery, pulling a bow like a warbow is a different compound movement from target archery. compound strength is the net strength of all moving parts, so it will also help if you use bungee ropes to develop other muscles that contribute to the bow drawing movement (specifically bungee because unlike weights, bungee chords more accurately replicate the power curve of a bow which we would see if looking at a graph). that being said, it is important individually develop the forearms, elbow flexors, biceps, triceps, back muscles, rotator cuff, trunk, and even your butt. all those muscles work to pull the bow but there are many as well that need to "hold things in place" and stabilize the ones that carry the most load. constantly shooting is one way to do it, but if we dont use low poundage bows, some areas will not be worked and larger muscles take over, prevent those weak muscles from developing. im pretty certain thats why when the op switched to a lower poundage bow he felt a better pump where there was no pump before.

the ancients would have been working hard anyway, therefore working those smaller muscles in a number of ways, if (from what little i know) there was indeed a movement of yeomen who were trained as archers and employed by the government, there would have been some element of hard work that helped them develop the strength to use those legendary bows. they probably didnt have the same labour reducing technology that we have (whoohoo john deere tractors!)

mike made a good point, you need to sort of train everywhere to get stronger and prevent injury.

btw adb, is that the arms of the canadian warbow society on your shirt?

Offline adb

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Re: Need advice on increasing draw strength
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2013, 03:55:03 pm »
Yes