Pacific yew self ELB excessive set?? [PICS ADDED] [maker has replied to inquiry]

[nineworlds9]

I recently acquired a beautiful self Pacific yew English longbow, 72" unstrung, 68" strung at fistmele, draws 64# @ 28". The maker described the bow as having "a couple inches of stringfollow/just the right amount"...I got it and it seemed good to go, shot it several sessions, always unstrung and stored properly. The maker only lives 3 hours away so climate is not an issue. The bow seems to have nice cast and shoots quietly. Anyway, after shooting it for a week I decided to measure the stringfollow myself, as the bow had a decent curve to it unstrung, drawing a straight line from nock to nock and then measuring from that line to the belly of the grip- 3.5-3.75"... I've heard 3" is about max desired. I need some expert advice.  The bow came with a fastflight string which is supposed to be ok for selfbows so I've heard.  I love the bow and it shoots nicely, just wonder if the 3.5-3.75" set is an issue.  Someone suggested I strap the bow in a form and heat it to take some of the set out.

***UPDATE:  the maker got back to me and laid my concerns to rest, I'm quite satisfied with what I learned.  This is the type of person it's nice to do business with.  Scroll to end of thread to read what he had to say!



On the floor, measured 3.5" floor to belly of grip:

[Josh B]

First off, welcome! . I'm not a yew expert or elb expert ( or any other kind of expert), but if you like the way the bow shoots, how much stringfollow it has really isn't much of an issue.  Providing that it doesn't continually get worse that is.  I wouldn't recommend trying to heat out the set on a broke in bow.  Some folks have had some marginal success at it, but chances are that you ruin a good bow attempting it.  Basically what I'm trying to say is, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.  Josh

[Newindian]

leave it alone, if it bothers you enough take it back to the maker to heat out the set

[nineworlds9]

Thanks glad to be here.  My main stomping ground has been tradgang.  Cool beans.  I re-measured it and its right at 3.5".  The set seems to come in right about mid limb..the handle/riser section are relatively straight.  I'd think that'd be good right? When I lay the bow on its back on the floor and measure floor to nock I get 4" bottom limb/ 4.5" top limb and if you subtract the handle thickness of 1 3/8" you get 2 5/8" and 3 1/8" bottom vs top respectively.  Yeah Im gonna leave it alone, it shoots nice.  I'm just spoiled cause my other ELB is a John Strunk

[RyanY]

I agree with what's been said above in that if it works then don't mess with it. I think as far as excessive set goes, in my opinion if it's above 1.5" then its too much unless the bow is much longer. You want enough set to tell you that the bow is stressed but not enough to hurt performance drastically. If the set is uneven as you say it is then that means the outer limbs are far more stressed than the rest of the bow.

[nineworlds9]

It does bend in the handle some when shooting.  Yeah Im gonna just enjoy it.  I'm not knowledgeable enough yet to do much about it. 

[Del the cat]

First I agree with everyone else. If you like it and it shoots well then ignore it.
Measuring it can be deceptive... it depends how you measure.
What i do is put it up against a straight edge say a wall with the string off and the belly towards the wall.
How many fingers can you slip between the wall and the grip?
1 is great 2 is ok,  IMO 3 is is getting a bit poor and 4 is bad.
I wouldn't want to try heat treating out the set it could well be a waste of effort.
A little set gives a smooth shooting bow and is inevitable, just about the only way to get no set is to start with an inch or so of reflex.
Del
(BTW there may be some confusion between set and stringfollow in thei thread. IMO 'set' is permanent and is there even if you haven't shot the bow for a week. Stringfollow is the icreased set immediately after shooting which will recover after say half and hour)

[nineworlds9]

When referring to this bow I'm definitely talking about SET...as far as after shooting, the set does not change by more than .25, from 3.5" grip to straightedge to about 3.75" after shooting.

[toomanyknots]

I think poundage and length can make a difference too. On a 40# @ 28" bow, 3 1/2" set is gonna be a killer, and string tension at brace height will most likely be quite poor. But on a 70# bow, string tension my be fine. If a bow is shorter, the brace height will typically be lower too, so that the limbs will be stressed less before being braced, even if it is a little bit. So a shorter bows brace height may be comfortably 5 1/2", while a longer bows brace can be 6 1/4". I fine set has a bigger effect on shorter and lighter weight bows, while longer and heavier weight bows can get away with a little more.

[nineworlds9]

Yeah, I weighed the bow, my pull scale isn't super accurate but I got something like 62-65 @28, so it's definitely pulling right around what the maker rated it at- 64 @28.  Who knows, maybe it was an even heavier bow when he first made it and now it's 'set'tled down to 64ish pounds from whatever it was when it was straighter? 

Also, string angle at the tips seems fine if you look at the pic, it's less than 90 at full draw and it was also less than 90 when I scaled it... 

[dwardo]

I recently went to my local Archery shop and had chance to handle all of their Trad Longbows. Bickerstaff and a few others all laminates mainly boo backed. All of the bows were new and most of them had around 2 inches of set, one had over 3.

[nineworlds9]

I recently went to my local Archery shop and had chance to handle all of their Trad Longbows. Bickerstaff and a few others all laminates mainly boo backed. All of the bows were new and most of them had around 2 inches of set, one had over 3.

Hmm.  Interesting, that's food for thought.  I may have to email one of the overseas English makers for an opinion..

[burn em up chuck]

           whats your draw length? you appear to have long arms, compared to the door that is. If it continues to get worse, theres a problem. If not leave it or a mild tip flip.
           It just looks to me as if your over drawing it. that being said thats a place to start. I'm sure someone w/more insight will have more.
           Beautiful bow, could have also started out deflexed, I built one like that once. man what shooter.

[nineworlds9]

           whats your draw length? you appear to have long arms, compared to the door that is. If it continues to get worse, theres a problem. If not leave it or a mild tip flip.
           It just looks to me as if your over drawing it. that being said thats a place to start. I'm sure someone w/more insight will have more.
           Beautiful bow, could have also started out deflexed, I built one like that once. man what shooter.

I'm 6'2'', my draw is right between 28 and 29 depending on how much I straighten my arm.  I may have stretched out a bit more than if I were actually shooting, as I was trying to get a good pic to study the string angle and tiller at max draw.   How shoot depends on the bow and brace height, though I'm usually within a 1/2".  My other ELB, a Strunk, is only tillered to 27", so I have to short draw that one, which funny enough helps me get a nice sight picture, I'm actually dang accurate with that bow.  Some bows I keep a little more bend in my arm.  This bow is rated for 28, so it should be ok hopefully.  Going to keep shooting it and keep measuring it the day after for a while to see if it is stable. 

Could I achieve a tip flip just from some judicious heating and bending at the tips?...

[Del the cat]

My big old Yew self bow has about that much set and it still shoots fine, I've overdrawn it to 31" which hasn't helped.
I would seriously urge you not to mess with a bow you didn't make yourself.
You could very easilly do more harm than good.
If the wood is near it's limits all you will achieve is slight recurve at the tips and more set elsewhere.
Personally I'd leave it well alone, it seems to have plenty of character, and that set may well be the price you pay for it.
Please don't mess with it. If you are actually unhappy with it contact the bowyer.
If someone was complaining about a bow I'd made, my attitude would be, let me see it and I'll advise what is required, if there's a problem I'll fix it. If someone tried to 'fix' one of my bows I'd give 'em short shrift.
Del
Note:- I was slightly confused when you said you measured to the 'back' of the grip, that's why I gave my 'fingers' explanation. I think you mean the belly of the grip. (I know 'back' sounds right... but it isn't)

BYW I'm an 'Overseas English maker'  !