My first elb

[carpenter374]

Hey all. I tillered this bow today. It's been a while since I made a bow. I almost forgot how rewarding it is to see a new one launch a good arrow It's hickory. 72" t2t. Just over an inch wide at the handle. It tapers to 7/16" at the nocks. 73# @ 33" (warbow draw length) or 65#
@ 29 1/2" (hunting draw). I still plan on heat treating. It took 1 1/2" of set at final tiller. I figure this oughta come out with the heat. I have made quite a few flat bows but this is my first elb. I was amazed at how fast the tiller went. It took less than an hour from start to finish. Flat bows usually take me about 2 hours with hand tools.

First pic is at first low brace. Areas pencil marked for wood removal. Second is full draw on a tiller stick. Tiller isn't perfect but this one lost weight...very fast. I plan on making a few minor adjustments after heat treating. Third is me pulling full draw with a hunting style draw.

[carpenter374]

pic 2

[carpenter374]

and #3

[carpenter374]

On another note: how mush reflex should i put into it with heat treating? I don't want to try too much. It has very little hand shock and I'd like to keep it that way. I don't want to over-stress it either.  Thanks for reading

[Del the cat]

Personally I'd think put in say 1" of reflex evenly over the whole bow (maybe 2" absolute max, and expect it to pull out during tiller leaving a straightish bow)
I'd think tou can improve the tiller a bit before heat reating, as the heat treatment should raise the weight a bit.
It's a fairly short bow for 33" draw, so I think you want the entire bow working as much as possible.
It looks to me as though the outer half of the top limb isn't flexing much.
The picture on the tiller stick looks very assymetric with the outer half of the left limb looking very stiff and then it goes into a fairy hard bend which looks like it will start to chrysal pretty quick IMO
Del

[carpenter374]

Hey all. Here's a touch-up tiller pic on this one. Thanks for all the help. I rushed through the bow beginning with. I looked at this bow the next day and yeah it needed more work. 5 pounds less on the draw but it's a heck of a lot more even now. I still plan on heat treating.  Still 1 1/2 ' of string follow unbraced. I think the heat will take it out.  Anyway, insert pic here

[Del the cat]

Yeah, that's much better.
Heat tempering the belly will probably get you back the 5#, and if you don't go too mad with the reflex you shold end up with a nice bow.
Del

[crooketarrow]

  That 1 1/2 set is cruched wood cells they can't be repaired and steamimg will look good unbrased but set and straing follow will return. Once set is there it's there. Only sinewing will help in some times. If your going to heat treat do it before you tiller, before you end up with the cruched wood cells. Cruched wood cells comes form either to much weight for the design or as you tillered you drew pass you intented draw weight. Or you tillered it to fast not getting the still parts as you went. This crushs the wood cells on either side of the stiff spot.

[Del the cat]

  That 1 1/2 set is cruched wood cells they can't be repaired and steamimg will look good unbrased but set and straing follow will return. Once set is there it's there. Only sinewing will help in some times. If your going to heat treat do it before you tiller, before you end up with the cruched wood cells. Cruched wood cells comes form either to much weight for the design or as you tillered you drew pass you intented draw weight. Or you tillered it to fast not getting the still parts as you went. This crushs the wood cells on either side of the stiff spot.

Yup, that's the theory, and I agree you'd ideally do the tempering and bending at the early stages of tiller, say floor tillered.
But maybe tempering will stop it getting worse and progressing to chrysals (which I think is quite likely with an Ash bow at that draw length).
A few weeks back one of the guys posted some results of doing this very same thing (with some added rapid cooling to add to the confusion, he reported some improvement.
I think we all need to experiment. Bear in mind this bow hasn't been shot much yet.But it's defininitely a case of 'do it at you own risk'
Maybe temereing but not trying to take out the set would be safer, I certainly can't see any harm in that.
Del

[Buckeye Guy]

Listen to Del ,he knows about ELBs
But I am telling you Hickory loves heat ,pour it on , and now is the best time to do it !!
Guy

[carpenter374]

  That 1 1/2 set is cruched wood cells they can't be repaired and steamimg will look good unbrased but set and straing follow will return. Once set is there it's there. Only sinewing will help in some times. If your going to heat treat do it before you tiller, before you end up with the cruched wood cells. Cruched wood cells comes form either to much weight for the design or as you tillered you drew pass you intented draw weight. Or you tillered it to fast not getting the still parts as you went. This crushs the wood cells on either side of the stiff spot.

Read TBB vol 4 ppg 63-65. Marc St. Louis talks about heat treating an old bow that had about 1 in of string follow. It remained straight after heat treating. I'll post finished pics after I get this one heat treated.

[Jim Davis]

It still looks to me like the tiller is off. Left limb still bends mostly in the middle and the right limb is still too stiff in the middle.  You are begging for trouble if you leave it that way, IMO.

I agree though, that heat treating will help. I do it all the time to keep from losing weight or to stiffen a limb or any time I want to gain weight.

Jim Davis

[Del the cat]

It really needs a good picture without the angled weatherboard and the skewed shadow to confuse the eye.
Its a bit like one of those optical illusions at the mo', so it's hard to really be certain.
Del

[mikekeswick]

Yes a photo of it un-strung , strung and drawn are neded. The tiler should be corected before heat treating.

[Slackbunny]

ELB? Eastern long bow? What does that stand for?