Author Topic: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off  (Read 89077 times)

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blackhawk

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #30 on: July 14, 2011, 07:46:35 am »
I also encourage anyone to post pictures here of there bow,unless they wanna keep there recipe a secret then I understand as well.  >:D


Ill also add that you PLEASE pm me that the bow was sent so Ill know when to be expecting it and I can check you off that it was sent,and then check you off after its received as well. And I will pm you that the bow was received.

Offline HoBow

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #31 on: July 14, 2011, 08:43:15 am »
If we are going off of BOM rules, a soft backing (ie fabric) would be allowed. 
Jeff Utley- Atlanta GA

blackhawk

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #32 on: July 14, 2011, 09:14:19 am »
Thanks for clarifying that with me hobow. I've corrected it in my first post. The bow must be unbacked. <----that's a period.

Hobow. Do you as well feel the need to have to put on a soft backing? Or just correcting and clarifying the rules?

Offline toomanyknots

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #33 on: July 14, 2011, 09:59:24 am »
Although I would like to be able to use a fabric backing, (just cause you can only stress kiln dried red oak so much. But with a good linen fabric backing you can get away with alot more, allowing more stressed better performing designs to be possible = funnier contest,  ;D), I can see how all you guys would want it unbacked. It gives you only so much to do, so your skills would really really have to shine. It would be a really fun contest as well.

@ BLackhawk: I answered your PM, but actually I am not sure yet really if I am in or not. Is there a deadline to join in?
"The way of heaven is like the bending of a bow-
 the upper part is pressed down,
 the lower part is raised up,
 the part that has too much is reduced,
 the part that has too little is increased."

- Tao Te Ching, 77, A new translation by Victor H. Mair

blackhawk

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #34 on: July 14, 2011, 10:14:01 am »
Pm s have been sent out to those who said they were in or those who I thought might be or was thinking about it. If you haven't received a pm and wood like to join in on the fun then speak up please and mention it here or send me a pm,and ill get back to you asap.

Toomany and for anyone else that is questioning a joining deadline. NOPE. NONE. Only deadline is having the bow shipped and received by the deadline date. Just pm me or say im in on this thread and you'll receive the info you need from me. So if you change your mind in a couple weeks you'll still have plenty o time to get er done.

Offline Matt S.

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #35 on: July 14, 2011, 10:29:35 am »
I've actually thought for a long while that a red oak board bow contest would be great. Why? I think RO lumber is probably the "bow wood" most widely available (at least here in the US). It is cheap, so almost anyone can acquire a board or two. RO is a mediocre bow wood, so good bows REQUIRE good skills (i.e. it is less forgiving than the "better" bow woods). And finally I think it would just be awesome to see how many great bows can be made from this wood that only a few years ago was thought of as "non bow wood".
And I think we need to thank the intrepid bowyers of the 80s an 90s, especially Tim Baker and the others who helped with the TBB series, for dispelling the "yew or osage ONLY" myth. Without them I doubt I'd ever have gotten into making bows and this contest would never be happening.

Offline HoBow

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #36 on: July 14, 2011, 10:32:56 am »
I don't see a need, but the devil is in the details  >:D ;) 
Jeff Utley- Atlanta GA

blackhawk

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #37 on: July 14, 2011, 10:50:02 am »
I don't see a need, but the devil is in the details  >:D ;)


Lol...and this is what will separate the men from the boys. Too bad im just still a toddler.  :laugh:


Matt S. This should be fun if everyone walks the talk and it comes to fruition. I can't wait.

Offline toomanyknots

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #38 on: July 14, 2011, 10:58:22 am »
Thinking about it again, I would say that a stiff handled, pyramid limbed, with longer than usual as well as reflexed as much as tension strength will allow levers, mollegebet kinda bow would be where the money is at. For one you need low mass on the outer most part of the bow, as low as you can get. So;

Lowest outer limb mass - check

As well as you want to stress the wood as much as you can at brace to get as much early draw weight, like having a reflexed sinew bow or just a plain reflexed bow, when braced, from being so reflexed, has had to bend alot more then a normal straight bow to be braced and therefor adds alot more early draw weight than a normal straight bow. Visual Example:



So having the levers reflexed would make the limbs have to bend alot more than a straight bow, (pretty much the same priniciple/effect of bracing a reflexed bow but backwards I guess  ;D), so:

Early draw weight - Check

I also think that the pyramid limbs could be fairly wide at the fades if wanted and it probably wouldn't effect performance too much as long at they tapered to 1/2" or so at the beginning of the levers. Might reduce set as well compared to making them as thin width wise. One thing that is important to realize with bows like this ( that I have just realized, I am actually only working on my first mollegebet right now, my first didn't turn out too well, lol, so don't think I have made alot of these bows or anything), but one thing I have come to realize is that the longer the none working levers are, the less the actual working limbs have to bend/work, so the longer the none working levers are = the less stressed the working limbs are. So if you combine that knowledge with the early draw weight increase of reflexed the levers as much as possible, then you can max out the early draw weight at brace by making the working limbs short enough and the levers reflexed enough to be stressed to the max, and then get the draw you want and keep the stress down on the bow during draw by making the levers long enough to not brake the working limbs during draw? Also, I do know that string bridges can really send an arrow flying, as well as make early draw weight ridiculous if the lever angle is enough that the bow basically becomes a 40" bow at brace and then the string lifts off to become a 65" bow or so at full draw, making it smooth at full draw but sending the arrow flying with the early draw weight of a 40" bow braced to 6". I have read (somewhere) that the manchu bows with their string bridges and crazy angled siyahs had the highest force draw curve.

...so,... what do you guys think?
"The way of heaven is like the bending of a bow-
 the upper part is pressed down,
 the lower part is raised up,
 the part that has too much is reduced,
 the part that has too little is increased."

- Tao Te Ching, 77, A new translation by Victor H. Mair

blackhawk

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #39 on: July 14, 2011, 11:05:31 am »
Toomanyknots

Smells like your cooking up a good recipe. I like it. I wanna see it done. Pleeeeease change your mind. At least I got ya thinking about design in bows  ;)

Offline toomanyknots

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #40 on: July 14, 2011, 11:08:08 am »
I might blackhawk, sure was a fun idea ya had!
"The way of heaven is like the bending of a bow-
 the upper part is pressed down,
 the lower part is raised up,
 the part that has too much is reduced,
 the part that has too little is increased."

- Tao Te Ching, 77, A new translation by Victor H. Mair

Offline Ifrit617

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #41 on: July 14, 2011, 12:54:53 pm »
Man I wish I could participate in this  since most of my bows are from red oak and I can always get it preform real well... Only problem is I don't have the money to ship a bow anywhere, especially not twice... :( anyways sounds like a great idea And a real fun one...

Also I might have missed this but are the bows straight stave designs only? Or are recorded and reflex allowed?? Just wondering... Can't wait to see the results...

Jon

blackhawk

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #42 on: July 14, 2011, 12:59:00 pm »
You can recurve,reflex,deflex....whatever you want. As long as it adheres to being unbacked on the limbs. Ill send you a pm and maybe we can work the money thing out seeing how your a young strapping lad.

Offline peshikthe

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #43 on: July 14, 2011, 04:16:49 pm »
im in, i have made several red oak bows , my last was a molle that i gave away at cloverdale that was crazy fast. this sounds fun.
im a man, i can change, if i have to, i guess.

Offline johnston

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Re: Red Oak Board Bow Cook Off
« Reply #44 on: July 14, 2011, 04:45:56 pm »
blackhawk I got your pm and yessir I am in.

I should not be surprised ( but I am ) at the competitive nature of our little group. But one thing I have not seen mentioned except in passing is the manly test of longevity. How exactly is this to be determined and does it ( as it should ) carry the same weight as a bow speed test? I mean anybody can build a flash in the pan wizz bang. At the end of two years shouldn't the surviving bows, mine included, be speed tested again ?