Hickory string follow

[chuckp]

I'm having a blast learning about making self bows. I have to say experience is the best teacher but he who learns by experience is a fool. Well, I'm a fool. I cut down a hickory made quite a lot of staves. I got carried away and tillered one too soon. Seems like I developed a case of string follow. I'm happy with the bow so far, came out a little lighter than I expected, but the string follow wasn't figured on.
Now I guess I jumped the gun and tillered too soon. I guess the wood was too green and didn't get the spring yet. Probably did some belly cell damage. What should I do now? Is there any hope for this bow or should I just move on and be more patient from now on.

[ken75]

steam in some reflex on the tips , and keep trying . itll get better

[Parnell]

When did you cut it?  If you bring it close to the dimensions of floor tiller and let it sit for a bit longer it'll dry much faster.  Also, I put mine in the car and it really took the moisture out quickly.  You can also consider smoking the roughed out bow over a low heat smoky fire for some extended time...6-8hrs., perhaps.

[chuckp]

I only cut it about 3 weeks ago. I split it, axed it to rough shape, floor tillered. I did set it in a car a few days.

[Cacatch]

The hard lesson here is the same one I had to learn a while back: dried is not cured. Whitewoods especially are prone to a large ammount of set if they are not cured properly, even though they may be fast-dried very well. I recently made an unbacked white elm bow, that I dried the heck out of for 2 weeks after I roughed it out to pre-tiller. I roasted it over fire, over the stove, put it on the dash of my truck in the sun for a few days, roasted it some more, until finally I was worried that I had it TOO dry. When I'd tap it with my fingernail, it sounded dry and hollow, so I know I had most, if not all the moisture out. After stringing it and pulling back a few times closer and closer to full draw, it started taking more and more set each time. Til finally it had taken 3.5 inches of set and it was only a 62" bow. By this time I realized what I had done and that the wood was ruined. So I decided to cut it down and thin it out and make it a kids bow. After cutting off one end and looking at the grain, I noticed the grain lines were GREEN! This wood had not seasoned hardly at all, after having been cut for 3 weeks, despite all the heat I put to it and how thin I had it. Hickory, hackberry, and elm are all great bow woods, but they must cure. I am certain this is your problem too. I would put the bow up for a few months and not touch it at all. Then come back to it and take what you can. It will have most if not all the set you are seing now because the damage is already done. But, as said, you may be able to recurve the tips or try to heat some reflex into it.

You'll know next time...as will I 

CP

[Gordon]

The hard lesson here is the same one I had to learn a while back: dried is not cured.

What is the difference?

[chuckp]

All good advice about curing whitewoods. I was impatient. No big deal, I learned a lot. I think I'll just keep cutting and roughing out hickories. Stack em in a good spot and wait.

[Mark Anderson]

Some good advice already, also, if you use a hot box, even a cheap (Stovepipe and lightbulb) you can get a bow done in as little as three weeks, I've seen it done. BUT it's not always the best thing to do. Hickory is hard to get down to that ideal 9% moisture content, it is a thirsty wood and doesn't know when to say when... If  you're running your AC already you can keep it in your house and that will help it dry faster and stay consistently dry while you're working on it. I think the only bad thing about getting woods to dry quickly is checking or over-drying. I have never had hickory check horribly on me but I always cut mine 7'+ so I have plenty of room to work with on either side.
Good luck on the next one!
Mark

[Hillbilly]

How much follow did you wind up with? A couple inches won't make too much difference.

[Cacatch]

Gordon,

I agree!     A person wouldn't think there would be any.   But evidently, there is. Now, I am not a scientist at all, so I probably cannot give an adequate explanation as to the technical diference...but I'm sure there are guys on here that can. Actually, I am pretty sure I have seen old threads that were centered on this very debate, and I don't want to open that back up. All I can tell you is my experience, which is, I had that elm as dry as it could get. I heated it several times in flame and over the stove, and had it sitting all day in the sun on the dashboard of my truck, and yet, when I cut the tip off as I said, it was green.

I think you can dry some woods all you want to, but if that wood has not yet fully "accepted" that it is dead and should give up the ghost and that the fibers should crystalize themselves, then it will still take considerable set because it still hasn't had time to realize that it is cut and dead. I think some woods are worse at this than others. But just ask any of the hardcore osage guys, if they'd prefer a roughed out osage stave that has been heatbox cured for 2 months or the same roughed out osage stave stored in regular dry air for 2 years and see which they prefer. They will all say "I'll take both!" but in honesty will prefer the 2 year cured stave every time if they can only pick one.

I made a bow a few months ago from white elm with the same dimensions as the one that took 3.5 inches of set, only it had been air dried for 2 years, and it takes a very small ammount of set when strung, but when unstrung goes right back to 0. This one that took the 3.5" stayed that way after unstringing.

I guess maybe you could compare it to wine? It has to ferment, no matter what you do to speed it along, you cannot replace good, old fashioned, father time.

CP

[chuckp]

My hickory really didn't take that much of a set. I think some sprung back. One side is about 2" the other about straight. I'm curious, I live in the N.E, and we don't get dessert type humidity here. I'd say normal would be over 50%. How can I expect the hickory to ever get down to the ideal 10% or whatever?

[sailordad]

ok alright already
all this talk about your bow,and NO pics
shame shame shame 

serioulsy though,lets see a pic of it unbraced,braced,full draw,and just after unbracing it

[chuckp]

 

I know the pictures aren't very good. Did it in a hurry.
It doesn't look like too much follow, but it was actually reversed prior to tilling. The bow is tilled @30# 24"
It's only braced at about 4"

[gmc]

Congrats on your bow.

I've used Hickory both ways, seasoned and quick dried (six of one and half dozen of the other). I really don't think Hickory cares long as its dry. I take my Hickory staves down to 6.5% MC before starting. If you google "mositure content in wood" you will find a way to calculate the equalibuim mositure content if stored under those conditions. What it won't tell you is the amount of time that it takes to get there. I agree with 3 weeks as a starting point under low RH conditions with a small amount of air flow.

Hope this helps.

gmc 

[ken75]

not positive on this but right limb looks more hinged in the fade than set , could just be my eyes though, is there a knot in that fade ?