Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Shooting and Hunting => Topic started by: ballista on October 12, 2008, 12:11:46 am
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I wish i could post a picture of a nice, big buck shot with a my longbow, but that didnt happen today. today, I saw a deer, about 30 yards away, and loosed an arrow (cedar, zwicky broadhead) in that vicinity. the arrow soared way over, about a foot and a half. horrible. this was in the morning, at 2:00 i came in to have a bit of lunch (and take a crap) so i did a little test firing. my arrows are kinda fish tailing, enough for it to affect my accuracy alot. the arrows are pretty new, port oxford cedar, so im thinking of going to carbon, at least until i isolate this problem:traditional is a blast, but at the moment, as long as i get a deer on instinct, im fine. thanks, any info is appriciated. -jimmy (later that day i saw a seven-eight pointer at roughly 70 yards, right on the fenceline-god i wish i had a chance to hit that!)
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Jimmy, weren't you sure how your arrows flew before you went hunting? Before I hunt with any arrow I am sure it flies well or it don't go! No matter if it has a store bought point, trade point or stone point...it gets shot first before hunting.
Some broadheads have a tendency to wind plane. Have you tried other broadheads? Pat
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I agree with Pat. But what kind of bow are you shooting ? Draw weight, length, center shot, off center ? and what spine arrows are you shooting? at what length? and how heavy a tips? ......there are a lot variables in arrow flight....
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I have never really had broadhead problems with traditional gear. But wood check arrow flight with field points for proper flight and spine. If that checks out then make sure you have the broadheads mounted true and that you have plenty of fletch. Like Pat and Ryan said I flight test my hunting arrows and cull any that are not perfect.
Kenneth
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I usually have a tough time tuning broadheads. Practice arrows aren't as finicky. Broadheads magnify any flaws in matching. Usually the problems been that my arrows were too stiff, something that didn't readily show itself with lighter blunt point arrows.
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I would suggest you get your arrows sorted out before you go back out there. nothing worse than a bad hit, we owe it to the prey we hunt to always be at the top of our game when it comes to the hunt... I can relate.. when in my youth I was given some arrows by a friend.. they looked great and were sharp broadheads.. i was shooting a seventy pound recurve at the time and the arrows were spined at fifty... I found out later..... i shot a six by six bull at twenty yards right in the hip... arrows flew way off course, never found the bull and learned the hard way what not to do... glad you had a clean miss... if you arows are too light you can wrap some sinew around the shaft about four inches from the back of the point up the shaft. the weight forward will help stabilize the lighter spined shaft ... good luck .. HAWK
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unbelievable, 15 yards I just got two robinhoods, one went 5 inches into the shaft... feilt points too! thanks for all the quick replies! the only reason i mentioned the robin hoods were to say the bow shoots with uncanny accuracy, but my zwicky brodheads are just not flying well. I did practive with my broadheads, but my stand was 18 feet above my funnel where I saw almost every deer last year, at 12 yards so, I practced at about 15, pretty close range. the weird thing too was we were shooting a watermelon, and the arrow looked like it entered straight. I bought a 3 pack of the 3 rivers archery arrows today, with woodsman broadheads on 'em- oh my god. They fly like feild points! THE BOW: montanalongbow, centershot, 55 @ 28. *please don't look down on me for using fibreglass-I really, really don't want a gutshot-my hickory selfbow was just plain inconsistant. I used a compound all last year, but it just felt like a piece of junk, this is going to sound corny, but theres no real love in wheelie bows. but I do love primitive archery with a passion, learning more every day- and absolutley no one else in my family has ever done it, I hope to pass it down to my kids someday. anaways, do you guys keep the very tip of the broadhead sharp? I was reading ttb, and there's alot of hunters who insist on using rounded off tips on they're broadheads, needle tips tend to split inti the pose instead of penetratind well into the vitals, is what they are stating. well, at least its somewhat primitive, not bad for 15 either, although im sure alot of you stareted young too ;Dwell, going out at 11:00 tomarrow, with any luck, maybe one will come under my stand ;D thanks again, Maybe i can get some pictures up wif my fone. -jimmy
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Jimmy, It doesn't matter what you hunt with as long as you respect what you hunt. ;) If you feel confident with your Montana Long Bow then by all means hunt with it. Practice with your stick bows so maybe by next year you will feel confident to hunt with one of them. I have been building wood bows for almost 25 years. It has only been a few years ago that I felt confident to hunt with any of my own bows.
All bows are accurate if the correct arrows are used and your form and release are true. Pat
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yeah, thats what i was thinking too, pat- 15 years old isnt too bad for going out instinct for a very smart animal, in my opinoion ;) about the stick bow flight, my longbow was 42 pounds, and my arrows were 55-60, that could be a problem! 25 years, man, im sure alot of nice bows have been produced in that time. do you use stone heads too? thanks for all the replies, anyone going huntin today? its 85 degrees here in Illonois.... oi. I was going to, but they won't be moving until 10;30! oh... theres a full moon today though... you never know. with any luck, someone will see one. thanks, jimmy
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Nothing wrong using a fiberglass longbow in the "learning period". It'll help you learn how to shoot while you learn how to build bows. It'll also give you a "comparison" to what you can build your bows toward. It's hard to go straight from a compound to a selfbow.
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kegan, tell me about it- it is real hard, one thing I made sure was my consistancy, at 20 yards (can't bait her, so i'm over a funnel, 20 yards is a little under avreage) 3 out of 6 would hit that 9 inch foam circle... not good-the longbow is near the opposite :) so for now, ill stick with the longbow. I just finished up a hickory longbow, 68 ntn, exactily 42 pound draw... the exact same as my other bow... I was trying to take off as much wood with keeping a good tiller, but it does fly alot better. We have alot of neighbours, so I couldn't try out the broadheads, but theres something im my gut telling me they're going to fly better with this one. thanks for the replies guys, -jimmy
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Do you all find unvented broadheads of similar weight hit higher than points with minimal surface area? i am shooting old bear 2 blades (without the bleeders) and they fly good, hitting 6 inches higher at 20 yds. than blunts field tips. Do ya think most non-vented heads add lift to the front of the arrow?
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Different folks have different experiences with broadhead flight. I have never noticed wind planing with any broadhead but at the speed my arrows fly I wouldn't expect to much. ;D With so many variables like arrow, fletching, shaft type, bow draw length and weight, release, etc and of course the broadhead itself you will get difference experiences from different folks.
Wensel Woodsman(3 blade) is the only vented arrowhead I have shot. Old bears, Zwickey, Grizzly and the trade I shoot are all solid bodied broadheads, as are the stone points I use. Pat
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yeah, howard hill used a 3-1 ratio broadhead, the barbs at the end were vented, these were able to ethically take out anything from young squirrel to elephants ;D
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ballista- have you tried Hitting 'em like Howard Hill? I've been shooting "Asbell form" for about two or so years now, but in less than week my consistency has imrpoved after watching the video a couple times.
And my broadheads have barbs on them, sorta like vents, but don't hit any higher. I guess they need to be closed off?
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hmm....... well, i havent seen the video-but i read the book, it sounds very similar, its more of actually aiming the arrow vs instinct correct? it sounds like a good one though, i got a good movie on boo backed bows by dean torges, he goes through alot of the broadhead designs and what not-if you ever see it, buy it, its a good one, even if you're real primitive, the knowelege of alot of this stuff that he covers is good to know, and very intresting too-thanks, jimmy
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The video goes into form a good deal. Hill's book covers his aiming method, but doesn't really go into form. I've started to see why I miss, so I can correct it- and my consistency has gone way up.
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really? thats awesome- my consistancy is where my problem is to, bro- my first few shots are great, then the last few that are 3- 6 inches off :P it sounds like a great video though, do you know where you could buy it? there's a trad archery shop called the footed shaft in minnesota, the second biggst retail in the US, next to three rivers, but the shop isnt too big, a nice place. Im in illinois, my dad heads up there every six weeks, so they might have it- but these guys were shooting longbows correct? I was shooting a small heavily recurved bow today at my buddy's house, i didnt realize how much diferent shooting that kinda bow is! yeah, howard hill was a great archer man, i never realized how any game there were in the everglades until i read his book, a great read too. thanks, -jimmy
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Got to 3 Rivers website and request a catalouge. It's in there, they'll send it tright to your door :). Yes, they are shooting longbows. John Shulz (the man doing the shooting and teaching in the video ) is shooting an American fiberglass backed longbow (alot like your Bear bow).
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oh god, half the trools and strings i have is from 3 rivers! tanks man, will do for sure. I was going to buy a bow from there actually, but now i got that bear, im set. do you ever make bows with glued on risers? i know its not primitive, so maybe you dont, but i finishd the pistol gripriser today, tomarrow im going to work on the taper/tiller, 1.5 inch tapering to 3/4 inch, 64 inches long, 10 1/2 riser. im not sure how to tiller it, im guessing stiff fades, stiff tips, and alot of md limb bend... which im kinda trying to avoid. thanks, jimmy.
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I would do so mroe often (glue on risers) if my glue joints weren't so attrocious ;D! I like the freedom of amterial it gives to make it fit right. Most of the time, though, leather winds up as the handle material. More forgiving to my crappy glue-ups :D. As for the tiller, a circular, with a stiff center, tiller seems best for bows under man's height. Bending tips, bending just outside the fades. All the super stiff ones I've made came out way under weight.
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yeah, likewise, the riser bows ive made have all been about 20 pounds. this one's a monster, im hoping this one will be a beauty. so you wouldn't change the tiller a whole lot? i made a recurve last week with glued on padouk recurve bits, the riser popprd right off.... obviously a little too much bend in the handle i guess. well im going to get a camera this week, I'll post the bow within the next few days- the handle is kinda a knockoff of a savannah longbow, amazingly comfortable.yea, glue ups are hard if you don't have a plainer, i need to get one myself. -jimmy
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To help with that leave the wood under the limbs thicker (about 18" or more) and really make the fades concave. Helps me.
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oh, so there is alot of bend in the fades? I thought it was the other way around, but it does make sense. oh, I think i know why my consistancy was off on my selfbow, do you shoot underspine arrows if the bow aint centershot? I was thinking maybe its too stiff to bend arouund the riser, but thats just a thought. thanks, -jimmy
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I meant to type more than an 1/8" thicker than the wood jsut outside the fades. Resulting in stiff fades, but a more circular tiller to the limbs. But yes, for non centershot bows the spine is under. I'm shooting 60-65# arrows for my 76# longbow.
And I managed to knock a bottle cap out of the air last night with that set up :).
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nice shootin- I had a little hickory bow snap on me today, my glued on riser had an arrow shelf cut in it, and the riser popped off. so, i figured go with it, had it nicley tilleres at 20, pulled to about 26, crack! right at the shelf. im actually going to laminate a bow tonght, no strech wrap tough... thank you duck tape ;D lol im not so sure on how that's going to work, i don't have many clamps, so it's going to have to do. thanks-jimmy