Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: turkey4me on July 01, 2020, 06:52:04 am
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New to the forum and a novice at the craft so I would appreciate some input on a vine maple project. The stave I'm working with was oriented with the back from the tension side facing the sky as it grew. It was straight to begin with. Now that the limbs are tapered and shaped I am getting a 3" offset left of center in both limbs. It has me wondering if I didn't get the stave oriented correctly to begin with or is this just what VM does? The upper limb is deflexed 1" and lower limb reflexes forward 3". My question is should I get another stave and start over or move on to steam bending to staighten the limbs 3" offset?
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Welcome. A challenging vine maple stave may not be the best place to start out overall. Have a look at this thread by Gordon on building a vine maple bow:
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,53195.0.html
Mark
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You will become good friends with the steam pot!!! Be patient, and prepare to do your steams and or heat gun work more than once. It will save a ton of hassle when you go to tiller. Once you get to working you will find the wood to otherwise be forgiving. I say keep at it. Good luck!
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Thanks for the advice. I've read Gordons build along 20 times. I just wanted to not waste effort on the wrong stave. With any luck attached is a picture of my progress
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50068800097_d0b06b7959_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2jhpFU6)Polish_20200702_053348952_resize_15 (https://flic.kr/p/2jhpFU6) by Doug Webster (https://www.flickr.com/photos/189146934@N02/), on Flickr
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Making some progress with steam bending.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50111213703_51e25bf03f_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2jma4Za)20200710_171044 (https://flic.kr/p/2jma4Za) by Doug Webster (https://www.flickr.com/photos/189146934@N02/), on Flickr
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50111214053_2bed7eb4fa_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2jma56c)20200712_103343 (https://flic.kr/p/2jma56c) by Doug Webster (https://www.flickr.com/photos/189146934@N02/), on Flickr
This Split I don't know what to do about
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50111824271_0f65832885_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2jmdcuc)15947342715698204183294956820109 (https://flic.kr/p/2jmdcuc) by Doug Webster (https://www.flickr.com/photos/189146934@N02/), on Flickr
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I wouldn't worry about that crack. Think of a bow as a long bundle of incredibly thin sticks tied together, that's how the grain of the wood fibers are arranged. A little gap between sticks ain't breakin' the sticks. When cracks go across the limbs, then you got little sticks breaking.
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No structural problems. Fill it with whatever resin or glue you want. Or not.
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The greener you work vine maple, the more it will move, or you must pick a perfectly straight grained stave, it can be found.....good luck ;). If you dry vine maple in log form it will move much less, obviously you will have to wait more time for that (depending on temp up to 6 months, log form)
VMB
Super glue the crack, clamp it well.
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Thanks for the advice. I am realizing just how challenging this will be. I put the stave in a tillering tree and have the limbs moving 3 inches on a long tillering string. Left limb is out of alignment with the right by 3 inches. I am thinking my next move is to steam bend 3" of gradual recurve in the right limb to match the left before tillering?
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I see out of level, but you have it clamped sort of out of level.
you could remove the clamp and put a soft pad or something on the tree seat and pull three inches to take another pic
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Willie your comment inspired me to get a broomstick out. Pretty obvious that the handle needed some stock removal. It's looking much better now. Made myself a tillering gizmo and will be working towards 8" brace height soon. Other good news is the splitting in the handle stopped. I filled it with some G10 epoxy mixed with fine wood powder from sanding the handle level. Thanks everyone for the guidance.
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Pretty obvious that the handle needed some stock removal.
the handle should be whatever you like to fit your hand. If the tree saddle needs some padding to help the bow sit level, than that's ok. I use cork and actuall have a high spot such that the bow is kinda balancing right where the bow would be putting the most force on my bow hand, for me that is the base of my first finger about an inch below the arrow pass on the bow.
Made myself a tillering gizmo and will be working towards 8" brace height soon.
gizmos are very helpful. Do you mean to say you intend to brace it at 8"? I think most guys like to brace half of that or even less when first bracing during the initial weight reduction stage. getting the bow bending to at least half the bend it will have at full draw is prudent before trying to do even a low first brace. I get it bending even more than that. Having the bow almost done before first brace. Of course others do it different, but if you are tillering for the first time, be patient.
even if the check in the handle opens some it's ok, the drying happens slowest in the thickest section.
A pic with it bending three inches will generate more comments.
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Here's the stave at 3" of tiller. It's pulling 22 lbs on a spring scale. I might be crazy but with a narrow 2" diameter VM stave thought I should try a hollow limb profile. Using a 3" threaded black pipe coupler as a scraper is working pretty good.
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Here we are at 20". Tips are at 8". She's pulling 30 lbs. I see a pretty good bend in the fades off the handle and I hope I didn't go too far with wood removal. I'm hoping to be at 45 lbs at 28".
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good to see your progress man, Hollow limb is ambitious, but it looks like you got the stave pretty well steam bent into shape. To me the left limb looks pretty good at this stage, the right looks like it is hinging at the fade, I would steer well clear of the right fade for a while.
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yes, I would get the outer limbs bending more before removing wood from the fade areas. since you have it bent to what would be brace height if it were strung, you might compare your photo to braced similar bows.
if you shorten up the long string such that the "nock" point on the long string is about 6", your weight readings will be close at this point of the tillering process
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I continued to be plagued by limbs curving, throwing string alignment off center. I just kept heat bending, exercise, tiller and repeat till the string alignment finally centered itself. 4 cycles later I am at 38# and drawing a decent tiller. Not perfect but a good lesson.
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you need a tillering gizmo.
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To my eye still a tad stiff in the left limb outer third. You've come a long way with that stave. Strong work.