Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Primitive Skills => Topic started by: Zuma on April 28, 2014, 11:18:58 pm
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Last fall I was visiting a good friend Scott Silsby at his property
where he had a well drilling failure.
Cavernous limestone filled with clay?
The driller pumped out tons of clay trying in vane to clear the well.
My intent here is to clean the clay of impurities by soaking it in
water and straining out the impurities. Evaporate the water until
the clay is workable. Then prep the clay and build a pot.
Maybe even fire it in an open pit. This process will take time.
Advice and questions invited.
Scott saved a lot of the clay and it dried into huge chunks laced with limestone drilling's.
It looks like this at present.
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Rehydrate stir in 5 gal bucket wait 2 minutes then pour off clay into another bucket. The stones will fall to the bottom.
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Rehydrate stir in 5 gal bucket wait 2 minutes then pour off clay into another bucket. The stones will fall to the bottom.
Thanks iowa,
I wish is was that easy. In most cases I guess it would be.
This stuff was like concrete. Due to the drilling's I suppose.
I had to use a crowbar and huge knife to break it down in the water.
A lot of the organics and light flakes I strained out.
I have been pouring off the water as it clears at the top of the buckets.
I should have nice clean clay soon. Well if it ever stops raining and evaporation kicks in.
Zuma
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I will post a link to my process
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Well I got out my trusty coffee cup and panned some of the tailing's.
I was not surprised to find little magnetite and quartz. Very little.
There was a little green material and two jasper chips.
The jasper was most likely from the surface where the clay hardened on.
I have three buckets with very little clear water in them.
I wish I had wider, shallower open containers to dehydrate in.
Any ideas?
Zuma
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Thanks for the build-along. I have some clay in a "cut in" on my driveway. It keeps seeping onto the gravel. I need to dig it out any way. So I've been thinking of collecting it..
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here is a link to my project. I hope that this info will help
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,33703.30.html (http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,33703.30.html)
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I don't know much about this but wouldn't limestone be a no-no for firing. It's going to turn to lime in the kiln and will then slake if the pottery ever gets wet. I know you're getting the big particles out but won't there be powdered limestone in there too??
Don
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Limestone was sometimes added to clay by Native American potters to temper clay. The issue is not about the limestone, but rather its oxidation. If fired in a reduced atmosphere those issues won't be issues.
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hedge,
I hope you get some of that clay and build ya a pot or something.
Nothing like it.
bow and Don,
I'll attach a pic of what happens after you fire clay with limestone chunks.
Of course the pot and pipe were fired in a kill.
From what you are saying iowabow, is that happened because there is no reduction in a kill unless it is introduced. In a wood fire you have total reduction.
(burning organic material).
This is cool to know. Thanks for the participation.
Oh it wasn't until the first rainy day that the pots and pipes started to react like a pop corn popper.
Zuma
PS the pipe and pot were built back in 86 lol
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Hi iowabow,
Thanks
I read your link (part 2) mostly about adding burnt shell.
Not necessary for grog but for plasticity and shrinkage.
Do you think shrinkage does harm to a pot (stress or the like) ?
I wonder if my clay has enough ground limestone to do the same?
I have an extensive pottery collection. Most grog's are crushed quartz.
Some early ware with plant fiber, steatite and quite a bit of shell (mostly coastal finds) although some here on the Shenandoah use mussel shell.
zuma
edited the stress part
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Without having had a closer look, and with only limited experience, but I would say you do not need to filter that clay. If it comes from deep in the ground, it will not contain no debris of considerable size. Like roots or the like. Single pieces and larger rocks will also come out while wedging. Filtering is lots of work. Unless I want a super smooth surface, I dont.
I've also seen people filter the dry, crushed clay, but do this outside. Clay is easy to crush once it has frozen thoroughly and thawed again, then dried.
If you have problems with hard clay, simply soak it for a longer time. 7 to 10 days will make for soft clay usually even if it was dried completely.
for tempura, I have tried sand, crushed pottery and horse manure. The manure gives best workability and will result in porous, light, and heat tolerant pots. The sand makes for dense, heavy pottery, try out how much is good. Crushed pottery is probably ideal for many purposes, but it is so much work to crush and sieve the stuff.
I also got away with non-tempered clay more often than not.
Do dehydrate my clay, I fill it in a cotton bag (got it in hte army for the laundry) and hang it in a tree, the water will drip out within a couple of days. Professional potters seem too use plaster plates, thick, dense fabric will do as well.
Also, I would recommend processing quite a bit of clay at a time, as the process is messy and the product stores well ;)
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Thanks Jodocus,
Great info.
I will be looking for some tight fabric bags. Because dehydrate is
what I need to do faster. Great idea!
Since this clay came from a well being drilled, I had no idea what was in it.
The real reason for the filtering.
I had the clay in slip form in a day or two by crushing it in the water and
filtering through a sive was easy,when pouring from bucket to bucket.
Zuma
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I used a big slab of dry plaster of paris about an inch thick. Pour about a half inch of slip on it and it sucks the water out in no time. Of course then you have to wait for the plaster to dry before you can do it again.
Don
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Don,
Can you just scrape the clay up off the slab and use it to build a pot with?
Plaster is very cool material. You can mold it, sculpt it, and it dries real fast. Then you can saw it, grind it or sand it. I have made plaster molds and cast objects in them from slip, silicone and latex.
Not elaborate as the split molds they use in casting large ceramic figures etc.
I would imagine making a 2 gallon plaster box or basin would be a little pricey?
But what a great tool for drying clay.
Zuma
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The clay I was using didn't stick at all. You just roll it off. I think it doesn't stick because it shrinks as it dries and sorta keeps pulling itself loose. If you put to much water in the plaster when you are mixing it sometimes the clay will pull little bits of plaster off when you are removing it. Keep a toothpick handy to remove them. The white plaster shows up well against most clay so it's easy to see. It was 10 or 15 years ago that I did this. It's basically a big flat ceramics mold.
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Great Don,
I wonder if abo folks had a similar method.
I am a antsy type. I got to get it done now. Since I don't have any plaster (yet)
I have tried a few other methods.
Jodocus, I folded a cotton sheet into four layers and tied it over a bucket.
I poured in the slip. Not a whole lot of water made it out through the material.
I squeezed the bag until some light color came through and then left it hang in the sun and breeze. Should work pretty good.
I also cleaned out the oven of chert and tried a baking pan full of slip at 175 degrees for the last couple hours. I dried a small amount in the open air to a workable consistency. It seems gritty but should be just fine.
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I wonder if you stretched out a chamois or maybe a piece of soft buckskin and then poured the slip on it. It would have to be a dedicated piece because I doubt the clay would come off cleanly. You just need something to suck up the water.
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I wonder if you stretched out a chamois or maybe a piece of soft buckskin and then poured the slip on it. It would have to be a dedicated piece because I doubt the clay would come off cleanly. You just need something to suck up the water.
All of these methods have merit. All worth trying.
Since today was a very low humidity day, I tried what might be the same as solar heat collection tech.
When the sun shines, light rays hit dark objects and heat them.
Objects lacking pigment reflect the light.
I had good overhead declination and a bit of a breeze. A better wind would have worked better for convection (air movement). Think convection oven that you can actually cook in.
What surprised me today is that the oven did not to do much drying?
The dry moving air was the remedy.
It's late so I'll post the photos and process soon.
Zuma
PS I need to post this one
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Slip in the sheet. I layered the sheet so the water would strain through four layers.
I became to impatient so I put the slip in pans and a cookie sheet to dry in the sun.
I started to get results.
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I periodically stirred the clay as it dried. Mixing the dryer areas with the wetter.
This seemed to quicken the drying.
The sun was sinking low and the potter needed some hydration.
Before dark I had about $5 worth of clean clay.
I put it in the container and into the frig.
Today is a chance of rain. I have enough to build a pot or two.
I need to decide what kind of grog to add and what style pot to build.
Zuma
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Well to antsy to not do something with the clay.
I'd see it every time I went for a beer.
There seemed to be plenty grit in the clay so I skipped grog.
May want it for a spagetti bowl some day.
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You keep your clay in the fridge??? >:D
Post some pictures when it's fired, please. :D
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You keep your clay in the fridge??? >:D
Post some pictures when it's fired, please. :D
Hi Don,
If I put it with the tea I would never see it and forget to make a pot!
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Zuma, it seems that I read once about preparing clay and it was crushed and pounded to dust, then rocks and such was cleaned out by sifting through screens. Once a fine powder resulted then water was added. Your clay looks great so it obviously is a good method also. I want to make some pottery also...it's on the list.
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Hi nc,
Seems like you had a good time at the Classic.
I think there are nine ways to skin a cat.
Same with the clay and additives etc.
Since the Industrial Revolution most potters have gone by the wayside.
But I can guarantee you, tremendous pleasure from playing in the mud.
Zuma
just a few other fun clay things. I shattered the cool Clovis taking it off the shelf. lol
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Here is a modern bowl I pulled from the kiln yesterday.
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Nice iowabow.
Did you spin the glaze on the wheel?
My boy has been telling me he's bored.
I sent him this link with a pot he did back in High School.
Hope he gets back into it.
My pot is taking for ever to dry?
Zuma
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I used the pottery wheel to make the bowl. The glaze was dipped and then the center colors were poured in then poured out.
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It's interesting that Native American potters were not much at glazing.
Although it's beginning around 3,000 years ago makes it pretty primitive.
Glazing is a rewarding experience. Like anticipating what things have turned out like when the kill door is opened.
Well I may be able to fire this pot in a week or so.
here is a cool link.
Zuma
HISTORY OF POTTERY AND PORCELAIN - HistoryWorld
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Fun thread! Thx for posting. I tried making clay with my daughter last summer. Thought we did it until we did the rope test and realized our slip was too gritty for pottery. Only time I ever did this so honestly didn't know if we were right or wrong. I used a 4x4 sheet of tile underlayment as my plaster. Worked great to shed water. I set it at a slight angle and while it absorbed from the bottom, they bulk ran off into a rag. Scraped right off with no problems. After seeing this makes me want to try again.
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Cool thread, nice to see you get along so well! Glazing is nice, but if you really want to go with materials you collected and processed yourself, it's going to get quite difficult. I have not done this yet, neither have I found any serious recipes. I guess you'll have to find lead and copper ores to make good glaze.
BUT, here's a video of what there is besides glazing, if you want to stay abo. Super simple means, super beautiful pottery:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkUGm87DE0k
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Don K,
I am guessing that you used a cement board? Good idea!
Please do try again. I would like to see something from you
and your daughter.
Jodocus, Thanks for the video!
Yes lead was important to glazing. I think they have lead free today.
The Virginia clay from here is supposed to be heavy in lead.
I guess left from decayed uranium?
I have some activated charcoal I was thinking of mixing with some clay (on a small scale to see what happens?
Thanks for the info guys.
My pot is still drying and shrinking.
Zuma
Happy Mother's Day
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Every day it don't rain I get more clay dry enough for use.
Wide pans moving air and sunshine.
I tried some activated charcoal mixed with the clay.
It worked very well, dried good in balls but to quickly
flattened out.
I guess I need to down load some pics.
Zuma
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Well about three weeks to get it all dried to a storeable state.
(ready to block) and use minus additives. I am debating whether
to use the kill or take all day and night to do a pit fire for the pot I built?
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I fired the pot yesterday and here it is--
I used a small electric kill and introduced some wood slivers
at the end of firing to burn out the oxygen,
Gives the rich brown color.
Zuma
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Looks good, have you filled it with water? I'm still curious about the limestone :D
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Looks good, have you filled it with water? I'm still curious about the limestone :D
I guess it won't do any harm as the particles are so small.
I'll get a cool drink of water from it. (evaporation through the pot).
The clay really did shrink a lot.
Zuma
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The shrinkage came as a big surprize to me on my first try. I thought I was making a man sized coffee cup and ended up with a shot glass. Not so bad after all >:D
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Lol Don,
Half of something is always better than all of nothing.
I think I fired the pot to stoneware. No limestone problems.
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Very nice. Glad it worked out.