Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: ozy clint on March 23, 2014, 02:51:13 am
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i'm making my 1st bamboo arrows and i'm wanting to know is it best to tune by trimming the front or the back of the arrow. i'd like to kept the haft of the point just in front of a node for strength but this will mean trimming the back of the shaft and cutting a new self nock and refletching each time and that doesn't make sense. lots of work! especially since i'll be tuning each arrow individually. is it ok to haft a point on bamboo in the internode region?
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Not sure about tuning. Having a node in front of the nock and behind the point is a good idea but will work otherwise. Just reinforce with sinew wraps to prevent the shaft from splitting on both ends. Are you thinking the arrows will need restraightened after use? I don't have any problems with my cane arrows losing straightness once they're straightened and sealed. Bamboo or cane arrows aren't going to wear down and need redone. Good luck!
Tracy
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What Tracy said. I never consider a node when making cane arrows. A sinew wrap behind the point and in front of the nock will keep it safe.
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Ozy,If you bare shaft tune you wont need to refletch every time you trim from the back.Just cut and renock it till it flies right for you then fletch it.Oh and tune till just a tiny bit weak because the fletchings will stiffen the spine a little.
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I spined my first cane arrows on this last batch per tenbrook's tomato stake build along above. I picked a real fine shooting cane arrow from my quiver and hung the two lb. weight from it while it was propped up on two nails 26" apart and made a mark. Then I set about checking the spine on the arrows I was building. I had cut them a little long and moved them back and forth on the nails till I could match the mark from my good arrow. Sometimes I had to cut from the fat end and sometimes I had to cut from the skinny end. This step has lead me into a batch of better grouping arrows. I used to think that bamboo/cane arrows didn't need all that, but I have changed my mind. This set shoots straighter and is more consistent from arrow to arrow. I don't worry about where the nodes are either. I cut them to length and wrap behind the self nocks and points with thread and clear nail polish. I have had very few problems with nocks or points being damaged with cane arrows.
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This is good info, keep it coming. I too am fixing to start my first batch of arrows from garden stake bamboo.
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I've been keepin a node just in from the knock and not worrying about the front. No dura ability issues whatsoever and I beat the crap out of my arrows.
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hrhodes I like that way also.I made up a makeshift spine tester with no numbers or anything.For each bow I have I made an arrow the shoots absolutely perfect bareshaft and then put it on the tester and mark it down.Then every time I make a few arrows I know exactly where to go to with them.
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Yeah, I used to never bother with it and just made a bunch of mediocre arrows till I came up with some that flew pretty good - I have lots of cane... I realized that cane arrows last a long time. If you make a bunch of crappy arrows, you are stuck with them! These days, I have taken some of the good advice offered on this site, and taken more time with my arrows and they have gotten a lot more consistent. The spine check is a good place to start. I cut the cane to length right after the spine checking routine and also mark the stiff side of the arrow at that time. I cut my self nocks right after. I have gone back to mostly three fletch arrows also. Having that cock feather to guide me into proper orientation of arrow to bow works better for me. I have also quit sanding the nodes. PatB's tip on heat compression worked well for me. I have a foot long section of steel rail that I heat up a little with the propane torch. I compress the cane nodes between a little steel bar and that hot rail by putting some pressure on them and rolling them back and forth. It doesn't have to be real hot and the steel rail stays hot long enough to do a bunch of cane arrows. This method keeps me from picking up the heat gun again and again. The nodes just go away under compression. Pretty cool - thanks PatB! I think it makes a stronger arrow, since you aren't removing material during sanding. Cane was put on this earth to be an arrow. They hit where you are looking and won't hardly wear out.
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I am soooo glad to here that some folks are checking spine on cane arrows...It does make a difference in grouping and flight. I have a set of brass rollers on the end of my spine machine that allows me to roll the shaft back and forth to find my cut off points and the stiff or weak side, what ever your preference. I absolutely hate to take the time to build any arrow wondering whether it will fly properly, doesn't make sense to me.
Don
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Thank you all for putting together one fine thread.
Such good sincere information.
Zuma
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Spine absolutely matters! Cane, wood or whatever you are shooting :)
The next thing to look at for tighter groups is point of balance. >:D
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Ive found with cane and boo that you can pretty much bet shafts of equal diameter shoot the same. I have no spine tester and make dandy cane/boo arrows that fly dandy with blades or field tips.
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Guess we are going to have agree to disagree again.... >:D
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Im not disagreeing Mike, just giving my experience. Ive made well in excess of 2000 arrows and never used a tester of any sorts, beyond my hands spaced 26" apart. Ive also sent them around to several pretty good shots with great feedback. I hunt and that's all I do with my gear and the only reason I build anything. If I didn't have great accuracy and flight I surely wouldn't hunt with them and I surely wouldn't have a full freezer every year for the last 26 and counting! I also think experience counts for something in our craft. Albeit bowyery or arrow smithing.
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I bought some bamboo skewer sticks at the dollar store. I then drill out both ends of the arrow about 3" and then titebond II the skewer sticks in each end of the arrow. It gives the arrow a nice footing that I can self nock on one end and cut a groove for a stone point on the other end. I also wrap both ends after nocks are made and points are installed.
This has also allowed me to use a tapering tool to taper both ends for glue on nocks and points.
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Im not disagreeing Mike, just giving my experience. Ive made well in excess of 2000 arrows and never used a tester of any sorts, beyond my hands spaced 26" apart. Ive also sent them around to several pretty good shots with great feedback. I hunt and that's all I do with my gear and the only reason I build anything. If I didn't have great accuracy and flight I surely wouldn't hunt with them and I surely wouldn't have a full freezer every year for the last 26 and counting! I also think experience counts for something in our craft. Albeit bowyery or arrow smithing.
I've made a few shafts as well! Around about the same amount as you in fact. Maybe even a few more ;)
I think experience is one of the most valuable assets there is too. In any field.
I can shoot well enough with unmatched shafts but I know for a fact that I can shoot better with weight, spine and p.o.b. matched shafts. That's my experience and like i said we will have to agree to disagree. Unfortunately without a shooting machine that imitates the human hand it's all a little bit subjective.
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I spined my first cane arrows on this last batch per tenbrook's tomato stake build along above. I picked a real fine shooting cane arrow from my quiver and hung the two lb. weight from it while it was propped up on two nails 26" apart and made a mark. Then I set about checking the spine on the arrows I was building. I had cut them a little long and moved them back and forth on the nails till I could match the mark from my good arrow. Sometimes I had to cut from the fat end and sometimes I had to cut from the skinny end. This step has lead me into a batch of better grouping arrows. I used to think that bamboo/cane arrows didn't need all that, but I have changed my mind. This set shoots straighter and is more consistent from arrow to arrow. I don't worry about where the nodes are either. I cut them to length and wrap behind the self nocks and points with thread and clear nail polish. I have had very few problems with nocks or points being damaged with cane arrows.
I agree 100% Shot a few into brick walls, telephone poles and 1/2 wafer board. No damage, cane arras are tough.
DBar
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Working my first set of boo arrows too so thx for the post! Keep it coming.
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I'd like to know from the group if there are effective ways to reduce spine on boo arrows? Sanding, grooving, etc.
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Art Butner removes the rind and scrapes his boo shafts so the spine is the same on all sides.
How much spine weight do you need to reduce? For each inch over 28" you can reduce the effective spine by 5#...so a 50# spined arrow that is 30" long will have an effective spine of 40#.
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Most of them spine between 76# and 91# I have a couple at 112# and 115# All of them are cut to 32" So if I understand correctly the effective spine is 56# to 71#
They all spine very close (within a couple #) to the same on all sides.
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Yes.
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Thx Pat. I'll try scraping the heavy weights and see what happens.