Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Ross.m. on March 01, 2014, 09:47:26 pm
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Just cut a hickory stave today. I cut a 12 foot piece in half and then split one of the two pieces. The split went kind of weird, I got one really small piece and one large piece. This is the small piece.
View from top:(http://i771.photobucket.com/albums/xx358/rossmartin98/DD3DA6AA-B2EE-42C3-8FA1-C47A29532A40_zps0muintap.jpg)
View from bottom:(http://i771.photobucket.com/albums/xx358/rossmartin98/541B0F0F-9939-4553-8150-2081D8EFDC4A_zpsgpbqztht.jpg)
The weird split gave me a very small stave, but I planned on making a pyramid, so the one thin end isn't as much of a problem.
The stave in total is about 56 inches in total.
(http://i771.photobucket.com/albums/xx358/rossmartin98/5E657FFC-4D48-4380-8BA0-D7C35FAD07FA_zps4hfwvqb4.jpg)
There are also some pretty big knots I'll have to work through. Is it a lost cause? Any tips as to how I should proceed?(first time making a bow)
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56 is on the shorter side for whitewoods. I would recommend a bendy handle short bow. 1.5" wide most of its length and probably heat treat the belly. Other with more experience will weight in I'm sure.
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So more of a flat bow than a pyramid?
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56" is perfect for a short bendy pyramid. Keep all the width you can.
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How do you make a bend in the handle as opposed to no bend? Tiller differently?
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Maybe this helps
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,34977.0.html
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Bendy handle bend for the entire length of the bow, while stiff handles have an (usually) 8" length which is completely unbending,(much thicker than the workinglimb) usually with a grip carved in and a cut in shelf. Do a search on the site for bendy handle and stiff handle
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That's exactly what I was looking for Jon! Any special tricks you used for that bow in particular?
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No special tricks. Hickory likes a good heat treating.
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Do I need to chase rings with a hickory ?
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Nope. That looks like the back of your bow right there in the picture. Unless its got some big gouges or scratches, that outer ring is the back of your bow.
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It does have some knots on the back. It is my understanding that if I leave them they will not be a weak point, right?
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You might leave the knots a little bit stiff, but what's really important is that you follow the grain around them and don't cut through them. I've worked some ridiculous knots in my black locust and vine maple, the consistent performers are the ones where I played it safe and worked things down slowly.
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Are these cracks too big? Can I still use this stave?
(http://i771.photobucket.com/albums/xx358/rossmartin98/9E9793E9-84BC-4D99-81D2-5BFA62F13F2D_zpstdetokak.jpg)
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Seal the ends and you will prevent those checks. They are drying cracks and run with the grain.
On your next long "pole" cut it down to bow length before you split it. On 2" to 3" poles if I know the grain is straight I like to saw them in half lengthwise then bind the two halves back together with spacers between them for good air circulation. This will prevent warping as they dry.
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Is the stave still useable with the cracks?
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I would try to fresh trim those ends and get out of the checks if at all possible. Sometimes those checks don't run more than an inch or so. After you get them cleaned up seal the ends immediately.
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ALWAYS seal ends of any freshly cut bowwood as soon as possible. Use a left-over paint, shellac, wood glue etc. and smear it on liberally.
I'm not sure why you cut this stave to 56". That is really short for a first time bowyer. If the trunk you cut was 12 feet, why didn't you cut it to two pieces each 6 feet? That would have been a lot easier.
I actually doubt that it's hickory. Anyone wants to take a second look please? That close-up of the end with the drying checks in it, doesn't show a ring porous wood like hickory. I actually think it could be a maple. Ross.m, how certain are you that you cut a hickory this time of year, without leaves to ID?
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I am sure it's hickory, shagbark is hard to miss.
I have a new problem, cracks have started to develop inside the wood.
I cannot see any cracks when looking from the back of the bow, but on the side there are clearly cracks. What are they?
(http://i771.photobucket.com/albums/xx358/rossmartin98/Mobile%20Uploads/2B413F4F-D814-4368-97E3-5BC1B802A4A0_zpswkjixzhw.jpg)
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I would guess they are drying cracks like you have on the ends. Did you seal the backs when you took the bark off? What i'm thinking is that the outer wood dried rapidly, and it's causing fibers in the wood to separate.
Care to go into your process of what you did in terms of your drying process? Hickory doesn't like to give up its moisture, and usually dries slowly. Did you put it somewhere very hot and dry for a period of time? Was anything sealed, or was the bark just removed and the stave left to dry like that?
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It still does not look like hickory :-X
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Ends were sealed about a week ago. I put the stave at rough bow dimensions except for thickness. I have been slowly getting the stave down to more precise bow dimensions while it is sitting in an indoor room at about 72 degrees and a RH of 25%. It is as moist as I can find in my house
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It still does not look like hickory :-X
Are there any tests I can do now to prove your theory?
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Those cracks are drying checks, caused by the wood drying too fast on the outside, while the inner wood is still wet. The shrinking surface wood has no place to go, so it's tears apart.
There are two things you can do: First, reduce it to near finished bow dimensions. The thinner the wood, the less drying forces can build up, because there is simply less wood to build up these forces. Second, move the wood to a place so it dries slower. That will cause less of a difference between the moisture content of the inner and the outer wood. Find a place that is colder and/or more humid and/or has less air movement (wind). An RH of 25% is really low. If that is as moist as you can find in your house, try to move the wood outside the house (cellar, garage, shed etc.). If that is not possible, wrap the stave in something that will slow the release of moisture to the air. Wrap it in news paper (plastic is too moisture resistant for my liking and tends to keep in all moisture, which is undesirable and may cause fungus). Or coat the entire surface in shellac.
I still think it is not hickory, because I don't see a ring porous wood in the pictures. It has every appearance of a diffuse porous wood (such as maple). If you can make a clear close-up picture of the wood and show the (ring) porous character of the wood, I'll stand corrected. Make a pic outside, in broad daylight, with the camera set in 'macro' mode (the icon with the little flower). Maple is still excellent wood! So don't be frightened. The design of the bow just depends on the wood species (although maple and hickory both handle similar designs pretty well).
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Alright thanks dark soul! I'll try to post that picture sometime tonight.
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Its hard to see clearly in the pic but those look like laminar separations between the growth rings, if so thats bad news. Ive cut lots of hickory and only seen it check like that on the sides one time. The only time it did was when I cut a tree in the summer and left it on the ground for about a week before I went back to get it. After I split it I could see it had already started spalting and within another week it had laminar seperations all over it.
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I think its hickory.
I have never had much checking on maple. Rocky Mountain maple anyway.
Patrick