Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: DuBois on December 12, 2013, 05:51:22 pm
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57" n-n mulberry with 2.25" reflex and slightly flipped tips. 1-3/4" wide at fades down to 3/8" tips. Moderately crowned with a little propeller twist and one concave part of back. Will bend through handle.
Should the belly be flat or somewhat rounded?
Also, do you keep a bendy handle flat and pretty much rectangular in profile before tiller and then build it up to fit your hand after tiller or round handle edges a little or....?
(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s662/mdubois7/005_zps17a6ff9c.jpg) (http://s1311.photobucket.com/user/mdubois7/media/005_zps17a6ff9c.jpg.html)
(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s662/mdubois7/003_zpsac09dbdd.jpg) (http://s1311.photobucket.com/user/mdubois7/media/003_zpsac09dbdd.jpg.html)
(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s662/mdubois7/004_zps77b6d629.jpg) (http://s1311.photobucket.com/user/mdubois7/media/004_zps77b6d629.jpg.html)
Thanks folks
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Did you make that thickness the same? Or is it deeper at the center?
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It's and inch thick throughout the handle/fade area and thinnest is 5/8 toward the tip flares.
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Mulberry can handle a bit of radius on the belly. If you plan to reduce the width of the handle area do it before you start tillering but don't narrow it too much.
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That was my concern to Pat. Doob's when you dont have the handle thicker than the limbs you pretty much have to carry your width through out. So basically and 1 3/8" wide bow is max if you want a slightly more narrow handle. If you leave the limbs wide and narrow the handle all the while keeping the same thickness, the handle will be the weakest link, thats never good.
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Thanks PD, so what poundage would you think is reasonable for a narrower bow like you're talking about?
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45-50 seems reasonable.
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IMO'....If it's 1" thick at the handle and 2" wide....I dough it's bending much at the handle. you might narrow the handle to 1 1/2 wide min, don't make it any thinner than 1" , leave the fades 2" wide and start floor tillering from there. see how it's bending. at 2 " wide, your short bow (59") 3/4 thk at 2" wide will not be bending much. Go slow and take note where it starts bending. again just IMO. I agree with Pat that a "little" radius will work on the belly, I think at 1" thick at the fades and 5/8" at the tips you have a good shot at a 50-55 # bow with 3/8" to 1/2" wide tips. Its mulberry guys cousin to osage........... as long as it's bending through the handle...... Good luck.
DBar
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Hey, thanks Pat, PD and Danzn. I'll let ya know how it goes.
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That's a little short, but I think you could go a lot narrower. And yeah, mulberry will handle a radiused belly, I made a stacked-belly ELB from it once.
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That's a little short, but I think you could go a lot narrower. And yeah, mulberry will handle a radiused belly, I made a stacked-belly ELB from it once.
OK, got her trimmed down a bit and overlays on. One tip had more natural reflex than the other and I was hesitant to push it any further than I did already so I thought I could even up the reflex by adjusting the nock depth :-\ I hope that's an ok idea?
The tip with more reflex also had a kind of burly knot where it looks like it split into 2 branches on the tree so I thought it should have overlay on it for that reason too. It is now 1 and 3/8" narrow in the handle by 1" thick, 1 and 3/4" wide at the fades down to 1/2" at the tips. The thinnest part of the bow is 1/2" and it is 7/8" at tips not counting the thickness of the overlays.
How do these dimensions seem to you?
(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s662/mdubois7/008_zps6e00835c.jpg) (http://s1311.photobucket.com/user/mdubois7/media/008_zps6e00835c.jpg.html)
(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s662/mdubois7/007_zpsab4696de.jpg) (http://s1311.photobucket.com/user/mdubois7/media/007_zpsab4696de.jpg.html)
Thanks, Marco
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I cleaned it up around the edges and the back. There are tiny pits at 5 different pin knots where it looks like a pin head size bit of wood came up when I chased the ring I guess. Other than that it is a beautiful backside.
Can I sand these out or should I back it? I have thought about sinew since some think it seems a bit short anyway.
Thanks, Marco
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I prevent that tearing out by circling the area so I don't run through them like that, I did it plenty myself. I will go around them and come back later to clean them up perfectly. If it was my project? Id just fill those tears with good CA glue and sand it flat again. Leave the backing out.
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I agree with PD, if the tears are tiny some Ca glue should be enough. I'm liking the way that bow is shaping up,
looking good.
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What PD and BB said :)
DBar
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OK then. Thanks PD, BB and DB. I'll keep on with the CA glue.
You guys think this is alright to tiller with it being below freezing for a few weeks now and wood stove/furnace going all the time? Pretty low humidity and I steamed both limbs to correct. How long should I give it to reach an OK MC?
Thanks again, MD.
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Have you done any floor tillering to date?
DBar
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I thinned it down just enough to get about an inch movement on each limb pretty equally but not a real attempt at floor tillering yet.
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Get after it doobs, only if it was dry prior to you starting it.
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OK, will do!
Thanks again.
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Re did the overlays cause glue line sucked.
Trimmed down some 1-3/4" fades to 3/8 tips and some wiggles.
Wondering about knots. As I get down into the wood one knot is punky and getting worse. Should I keep ati it until closer to bracing and then fill with cyano and dust?
Also, this knot on side about 1/3 down limb from handle that goes through to belly will get real close to being scraped away but I don't think I can get rid of it completely. Should I just keep going and deal with it later if needed or try to ream it and fill it or something?
Thanks again, Marco
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The punky knot does not go through from belly to back, it is just on the belly side.
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Thought about it a bit and decided to proceed until ready to low brace and then ream and fill where needed with CA and dust.
I have only completed 2 unbacked bows so I am gonna try to do this one unbacked. This mulberry feels so light it is freakin me out a bit :o
;D
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My suggestion, if the wood is punky in the knot, get rid of the punky wood and fill it with CA glue. I would do it early before you do a lot of bending, that way your working from the finished platform before you begin to tiller it. Small little knots like that, it probably wont matter either way but why take the chance. Looking really good by the way.
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It is looking good. What draw length do you want from it? Jawge
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Thanks guys,
I am wanting to get 45-50# at 26"
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Looks good, and that weight and draw length looks very do able.
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OK, thanks Eddie.
I have 4 bows going so I get to each a lttle at a time. I think maybe that is good though cause it slows me down a little.
Will post my progress as it happens.
Doobs
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I am not sure how to fix these knots that are coming out as I scrape more. The back has corresponding pins and knots that don't come through the wood but they are punky on the belly side the more I scrape.
If I try to ream them and fill them, won't they just get bigger as I scrape again?
Would you guess how deep and wide and try to clean out under the belly wood and then fill?
Or would you just keep scraping?
I am almost near low brace now but don't want to go further until I make a decision on the knots.
Mulberry is awesome looking stuff and I would hate to screw it up.
Thanks, Doober
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I am working a very similar stave of mulberry for my trade recipient, I will keep my eye on this thread. Lots of little pin knots and such. It is a bit freaky because its so light - I hear what you're saying there. My bowyers knot at the bottom is actually leaving marks in the wood on the belly because its so soft.
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The belly generally isn't a problem with knots. I would put super glue on each one and let it cure then begin scraping again.
Mulberry is a cousin to osage. Even though it I lighter it is quite strong and can compete with osage in performance. Tip overlays will remedy the problem of the sapwood denting.
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Tips are overlayed, the dents are on the belly from the bowyers knot being squeezed so tight with a FF tillering string. I was actually thinking of a little belly tip overlay on the bottom limb to remedy that.
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I don't use FF so I don't have an answer for that.
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all the mulberry I have is pretty darn hard, never thought of it as being soft
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OK then, I'll just dig out the little bit I can easily get to that is rot and super glue away.
Thanks folks.
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Trees are wonderful... they put in extra wood around knots so that we can make bows. Since punky wood serves no purpose, you can get rid of it and fill in or not as you choose. Your draw weight and draw length desires are conservative, so should be safe with a non-perfect stave. Looking at your pictures, I'd just make a bow out of it and expect it to hold together. Enjoy.
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Good point Michael ;D
How you doin?
Didn't I send you a mulberry?
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Those little knots don't amount to much Doobs. You can dig em out and fill em or just dope em like Pat said. Personally, I'd just saturate em in super glue and move on. Josh
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I have no mulberry, but I'm always looking. By September I'll be moving from Alaska to San Diego. I really hope to establish some hobby-friends down south... All of my bowyer work has been solo for years. Other than virtual with Y'all.
If you want to send that stave to me, I'll finish it up and send it back, promise. Actually, I'd do that with anybody's work at this point :).
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I've got a mulberry and a hickory that look like bananas if you want to try to wrangle them into shape?