Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: steve b. on August 14, 2013, 01:02:31 am
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I'm drying out a bunch of OS for bowmaking in the fall and thought I'd take some pics of the takedown pieces in case I do a buildalong then.
Figured I'd might as well post some pics now to spark some chat about the project. Let me know what you think.
These pieces are actually too big for what I'm doing but I figure too big is better than too small:
Bark on, Bark off, roughed out, worked down.....
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Gotta get the pith out of these green billets so they don't check so bad. I had some success with some smaller bows where I cut into the handle to get the pith out with the idea that I'll fill the cut in later with glue. The more material I can remove now the less likely they'll check and the faster they will dry.
I use the radial arm saw to cut just shy of deep enough to remove the pith then hand saw from there.
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That's all you got done today? Get those sleeve on there!
Lookin good buddy :)
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Go Steve! That's going to be awesome. That is also some beefy ocean spray! nice job seasoning it without checks.
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I try to control the drying out process by reducing wood mass and pith and by keeping them in the cool basement. Still some pieces will begin checking if they have natural flaws in the wood like splits and knots or if they are unusually massive or wet. So I keep them together and covered up so the moisture leaves them more slowly. So far, so good. I check (no pun) them daily and deal with them individually if I see checks forming.
Here's some roughed out bows and a bunch of billets and then the whole pile ready for bed:
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Man, you guys are fast. I can't even get all the pics down before I'm hassled.
Thanks Weylin. The key is to get the bark off and pith out and cool it down. After a couple weeks I can actually lay them out in the sun all day and no checking.
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Those are some nice pieces of OS! wow!
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Looking good so far. Any problem with srinkage on the area for the take down sleeves,or do you leave then a little big till it dries ? I would think if you cut them to size before well seasoned the sleeves would be to large,just thinking out loud,I have done several take down but it was always from seasoned billets to start with. :) Good looking pile you have . :)
Pappy
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I echo what pappy said about giving yourself extra room for when the wood shrinks.
Looks good so far, really looking forward to seeing the finished product!
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Do you crawl in there with them at bed-time, or just leave them all alone down in the basement like a bunch of orphans? Just ribbing you Steve, looks like your oeanspray gets pretty special treatment.
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I agree with Pappy too. These billets may warp and twist and shrink and split. So yea, I'm leaving as much mass in the handle area as I dare and after a couple months of drying I'll put the sleeves on.
Geez Carson, its not like they are osage staves, which are upstairs watching TV right now. :)
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This is perfect timing! I have a stave in the garage that I was babying along to slow down the drying and now I see you ripping the bark off and getting to it. I was being overcautious about seasoning I think. I've got work to do. I hope you don't mind a million questions. The first being the average temperature and RH in your area. I'm still a little gun shy about checking. Around here the temp is in the 70-80 and the RH is 50 in the day and 80 at night. Well except for the last couple of days the RH has been 100% >:( I will be following this thread very closely
Thanks
Don
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Looking good, but i would like specs on that way cool vice you got holding them there staves, i could really use one of those. ;D
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My luck so far with Ocean spray has been somewhat futile. It takes forever and a day to season, I have found that if you work it to soon and don't seal it right-away it checks real quick. Looking forward to see how it turns out..
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Don, I don't have alot of OS experience and I don't want to encourage you to do something that might ruin your stave. I'm in Portland, OR.
The typical OS stave that I have seen is not much over one inch wide. With all of those that I have seen, with the bark and pith removed, and slow drying for the first week or so, I could put the stave in the heat of woodstove or sun and it would not check.
I cut a stave in March and was shooting it in April. But I left the pith in the handle and it checked there. It took very little set but if it was a keeper bow I would let it dry another month at least.
I have never seen a stave that didn't check when the ends were sealed and the bark left on. Especially the larger staves that have defects in the wood. They will check under and through the bark.
Obviously others have different experience. But I can't stand waiting months for a stave to dry with bark on only to pick it up one day to find its checked anyway. So I started peeling and watching and at any sign of checking I would seal it up, wait a month, then remove the sealant and watch it some more.
My latest experiment is to not seal at all but to keep them covered.
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Steve, I'm going to watch this one closely. I have the stave you sent me hanging on the rack and haven't removed the bark yet. Would you recommend getting it off and closer to bow dimensions?
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Hey Fred. That stave is hazelnut and I have a ton of it and have never seen any checking. I would take the bark off asap just because it may be easier to remove it early, before it hardens. Otherwise, no, it shouldn't matter.
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Hi Steve
I hope you won't consider this hi-jacking. This is my stave. It's 71 1/2" long, 2 1/4" at the bottom,1 1/2" at the top. It has about 2" of reflex. After I bandsawed the belly I got a couple of checks where I didn't cut right to the pith so I panicked and shellaced the whole thing. The chunk on the right is one of the slabs I took off. It has had no special treatment and has not checked. I think this backs up your method.
Don
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Don you did the right thing if you didn't seal the area around the handle it would have split right through. OS only checks to the rounds pith and stops. When something round shrinks to quickly it's found to break or crack at the weakest point. Like a wet donut set out in the sun the moisture leaves and cracked form, now if you slow down the speed at which the moisture leaves the wood has a chance of dealing with the stress and the moisture can leave at a much more even rate.
What Steve is doing is making it to where the donut can only shrink one way eliminating checking for the most part. There is still a very small risk if a split developing in the bottom of the pith tunnel but is nothing to worry about with OS.
(Sorry about the hijack steve)
I cut the belly wood off and seal the belly of the handle and a line down through the middle over the pith so it won't want to split and the wood was dry in a couple month. tie the stave down bc it will move around while drying
(http://i1251.photobucket.com/albums/hh544/bryceott/null-131.jpg)
(http://i1251.photobucket.com/albums/hh544/bryceott/null-130.jpg)
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I didn't post this thread to show people the right way to do anything, but to open up some chit chat about OS, so this is great.
Yea, regardless of what is causing the checking, I thought that leaving the bark on is slowing the drying process whether the stave is depithed or not, and that bark on would cause uneven drying. All I know is that if you debark and don't depith the thing will blow apart. And if you don't debark or depith the thing will blow apart. Not sure about depithing and not debarking. I just want even drying.
Like Don said, if you leave even a thin layer of wood over the pith it will check through there. I have slabs of OS laying everywhere outside and none are checking.
If you take a debarked and depithed stave and cut a shallow slice in it, it will check there. So the weak spots like knots and rot start checking too. With those I superglue asap and slow the drying by sealing that area or with the sleeping bag.
sb
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Thanks for the thread Steve. Glad to see your experiments are proving out! I have a couple staves checking real bad but on the belly so I'll just cut them out. I have a couple we cut early spring that haven't checked...yet. I think I'll try your approach on one at leased.
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Are these of any concern? Actually these ones will be removed but I think there is some on the back. They don't look that strong to me.
Thanks
Don
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Here's a couple more pictures as I was cutting down into them. They look like they might be cracks caused by snow load that have healed over. Or something completely different.
Any ideas?
Don
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And one last picture. Each one off those lumps has these things in it.
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Nothing to worry about don.
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Don, there's no question that those are cracks and therefore weakness. I would worry but I'd build the bow anyway as you don't have a lot of choice in dealing with them.
Probably they are growing up through swirls/knots in the wood. You can tell when you are drawknifing on the belly as the knife will dig into those areas showing you that the grain is swirling. Those areas usually split open on the vinemaple staves that I've steamed and I can see the grain flaw so I personally would leave that area stiff during tillering.
If I cut a stave short and the cutoff has a knot like you show then I would steam the piece and see if it opens up there, or make a small bow from a cutoff slab and overstress the swirl with a hefty bend.
In your first pic I'd be less concerned about the worm lines and small edge knots.
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Steve
I kerfed the handle like you did and it's drying nicely. I got one little check by the kerf and when I looked at it I noticed that the kerf was opening like a clam. I figured the sapwood was shrinking faster then the heartwood so I shellaced the back of the handle area. Now the kerf is closing back up. Anyway my question is what do you plan to do with the kerf? Will you cut a strip of OS and glue it in or is it a good spot to put an accent piece?
Don
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Would be cool to fill with another dark wood. Ebony, african black wood, purpleheart, or horn!
I bet ebony dust/glue mixture would be the easiest
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Be interesting to see how it drys..without over checking, shrinking etc... Is there any Hawthorn or Choke cherry in your area, it is more forgiving when it comes to seasoning.......etc
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It's drying quite well. I de-barked it except for 6" at each end. I shellacked the ends and the back of the handle. It's been sitting in the garage on my workbench for about five weeks and the only check has been the one I mentioned three posts back. The RH has hovered around 70-80% for most of that time so that's probably worked in my favor. The only bow wood I've found so far are Ocean Spray, Douglas Maple, Pacific Crabapple, Saskatoon(Serviceberry), Cascara and back up in the hills there will be Yew. There is Hawthorn around but it's mostly ornamental(in gardens). Most of the above are small, so I will mostly be making sapling bows. There is a lot of cascara but I haven't read really glowing reports on it.
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It's drying quite well. I de-barked it except for 6" at each end. I shellacked the ends and the back of the handle. It's been sitting in the garage on my workbench for about five weeks and the only check has been the one I mentioned three posts back. The RH has hovered around 70-80% for most of that time so that's probably worked in my favor. The only bow wood I've found so far are Ocean Spray, Douglas Maple, Pacific Crabapple, Saskatoon(Serviceberry), Cascara and back up in the hills there will be Yew. There is Hawthorn around but it's mostly ornamental(in gardens). Most of the above are small, so I will mostly be making sapling bows. There is a lot of cascara but I haven't read really glowing reports on it.
Lots of Hawthorn down here in the Cowichan Valley...... ;)
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Yea, Don, I have on handle that opened up like that too. I don't have plans for it--I'll probably fill with homemade resin or wood inlay up through the fade.
A week or so ago I took my pile of OS outside in the heat and watched it over time. Some of the larger pieces began to check so I CA'd the cracks and took them inside. No further checking to this day. The heat was just too much to soon for the bulky sections. Lesson learned.