Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: tgtmatt on January 07, 2013, 11:52:22 pm
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Okay well where to start? I've completed 2 bows now, both red oak. First one at 30lb, second around 50lb and I just can't get the trade of arrow making down. I buy the 3/8" dowels from craft stores or lowes, etc. And I have tried to spine test them and I did fairly well, I suppose. Now I just cant find any good way to make fletchings without feathers.. I have tried duct tape as a quick alternative so I could get to shooting my bow and to see how it worked but it just didn't seem to work out. My arrow rest would just rip the fletchings apart. Anyone have good ideas or advice on what I should do? I'll post some pictures of my "arrows".
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Is the second picture bamboo? Because there is a ton by my beach house and I cut some down to try it out and i'm pretty sure it is bamboo.
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another picture
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I have tried duct tape and other substitutes, but nothing works like real feathers. Get some online or through the trading post. I mostly order precut feathers. Bamboo shafts will work- you'll need to dry them for months, learn to straighten them and you'll need to file and sand the nodes smooth like a dowel- some varities of bamboo are much better for this than others. like a bow, arrows are something that takes alot of time and it's own set of skills to learn. If you start "from scratch", an arrow can take many hours of exacting labor. For beginners, I reccomend buying a pre made shaft (not a dowel, but a shaft made for archery), and pre cut feathers. this will cost only a few bucks an arrow and will allow you to make a really nice arrow. once you see what that's like- graduate on to harvesting shafts, and splitting your own feathers.
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You said it well, I guess I've just been procrastinating and trying to put it off because I hate to order something I could try and make. But I guess i'll order some supplies and begin. Hopefully I find something worth putting in the trading post and someone will send me a few arrows (;
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If my draw is 28" how long should my arrows be?
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I draw 26" and cut my cane and hardwood shoot arrows to 29" to 30".
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Okay thank you. It's kind of depressing having 2 bows and barely being able to shoot.
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some nice cedar shafts are on trading post right now.....
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I saw that up there and thought about it, but I am still not sure how to straighten the shafts
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Where are you at?
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Location? South Carolina
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Location? South Carolina
Me too. Spartanburg area. And you?
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Myrtle beach. I know a girl who goes to USC Upstate right in Spartanburg, I think it's about 3 or 4 hours away.
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3/8" dowels would be way over-spined for even a 50# bow. I've found they usually come out to about 90+#s spine, depending on wood type. Also, your duct tape fletchings won't work very well. They'll behave like plastic vanes... ie. they won't fly well at all out of traditional archery gear. Bite the bullet... get some properly spined arrow shafts and some feathers. Do you have any poultry producers in your area? There is a turkey producer near a friend of mine, and he can get me all the whole domestic turkey wings I want... free. It's a bit of work processing, but they're free. Why spend all the time making a bow if you're not willing to take the time (or spend the money) to make matching arrows?? Properly matched gear is a joy to shoot... unmatched equipment is just bloody frustrating!
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I asked where you were because here in NC a post on Craigslist got me all the does tic turkey feathers it would take to fletch enough arrows to fight the Battle of Agincourt....
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I can agree with the frustrating part. If I made my bow almost center shot does the spine make a huge difference? Just a question to throw out there. So i should be using dowels of 5/16? I'm going to check craigslist now for some feathers and search around for some feathers. Under what city do you look? I can't find Spartanburg on CL. Also, How do I straighten dowels?
Can anyone post a link to a tutorial, I'm sure someone has done it before I just can't find it.
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If you look on Amazon there is a book by Nick Tomahama called "The Dowel Arrow Book". It will answer all those questions.
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I can agree with the frustrating part. If I made my bow almost center shot does the spine make a huge difference? Just a question to throw out there. So i should be using dowels of 5/16? I'm going to check craigslist now for some feathers and search around for some feathers. Under what city do you look? I can't find Spartanburg on CL. Also, How do I straighten dowels?
Can anyone post a link to a tutorial, I'm sure someone has done it before I just can't find it.
I've tried the dowel route. 5/16", 3/8", etc., etc... with poor success. The spine of dowels is so variable, it's ridiculous. Out of 100 dowels, you'll get 3 or 4 that are straight and come out at the right spine. The grain is also horrible, with frequent run offs. Plus, most dowels are beyond being able to be straightened. Like I said, bite the bullet, and buy yourself some properly spined arrow shafts for your bow. They're only about $30/dozen. Your shooting accuracy will improve vastly. Also, the spine is less important the more center shot your bow is, but it still matters.
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I was right where you were when I had my first couple of bows. I had hardly any arrows to shoot and the ones I had were no good for my bow. It was frustrating. My advice is to suck it up and buy a modest but well made set of 1 dozen arrows that are matched to your bow and then take your time gathering materials and knowledge so you can start making arrows for yourself right around the time you break/lose your last few arrows. That way you can start shooting and start shooting right. The arrows are a very important part of enjoying archery and you shouldn't underestimate the knowledge materials and work that goes into producing good arrows. You can definitely do it, but wouldn't it be nice to not feel pressured to do it just so you can shoot your new sweet bow? Carson at Echo Archery is a sponsor on this site and makes really nice arrows out of old growth douglas fir shafts. He has some pretty affordable options for simple but sturdy arrows, you should follow the link on my signature and get in touch with him.
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I'm going to order some arrows, anyone have ideas where to buy the best supplies to make arrows so i can get started on that also?
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3 rivers sells arrowshafts, and you can either trade on the forums here to get feathers and pitch for that, or you can buy it. You can also attach the feathers via superglue or sinew, sinew is a more authentic way of doing it an in my opinion it will hold better. Arrowheads can be bought all over the internet but 3 rivers sells them as well.
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No feathers? got any chicken farmers, someone who sells fresh eggs? turkey farmers, guinea farmers, craft stores, ducks at the park? Check out any craft store, or even Wally World's craft section, and you should find feathers. Go ahead and spend the money, for spined shafts, and precut feathers, and plastic knocks. Then like it was said, once you have assembled a couple of arrows, you will know what you want in a totally hand made arrow. Use that bamboo too! You will find you will love it, once you understand how to use it. Any shoot material is a lot of work, be it bamboo, or any of the viburnum plants. The dowels will have to be re straightened periodically, where as the boo will hold for a lot longer, and take a LOT more abuse! ;) But once you have have assembled a few of the arrows from the ready made materials, you will have the knowledge to start on the natural stuff. You can even use the commercial spined shafts, as a guide for your bamboo, or shoot shafts, in spine weight, and shaft weight, for a nice matched set. Also, a shaft, even boo, will have a stiff side, and a weaker side. Put the stiff side against the bow. ;) Go ahead and go for it! ;)
Wayne
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oh, just to let you know. 3 rivers sells 100 field point arrowheads for 33$ so basically 33 cents per arrowhead. very good deal! other than that you can get nice arrow points from nails if you have nothing else. up to you, but just something to think about, hes already pointed out that you can get feathers from all sorts of places. Making your own arrowshafts is time consuming, bamboo with a detachable shaft for the tip would be easier so you can replace the tips. then you can use your target arrows for hunting and fishing as well!
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Thank you guys, it's really helpful getting all this aid. I'm going to check out some craft stores,etc today so I can get some feathers and what not. Do you guys know where there is a boo arrow build along? I have tons of bamboo, do I let it sit out and dry before being able to use it?
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I followed the bamboo arrow build from the top of this page.
When you say you have lots of bamboo....do you GROW IT??
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Right next to my beach house there is like huge bundles of the bamboo. I cut about 30 pieces last week and it didn't even make a dent. Every weekend when I go up there I cut a little more so maybe I can start trading it to people because I have nothing else to trade :-[
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So I went ahead and ran to the store today and started myself some arrows. I think I did pretty well for the first time. I hope they fly well tomorrow. My dad was an elevator builder/tech and he has so many different tools/pieces for electrical hanging around and I happened to be looking through tools and I found these wire joining cups (i forget the technical name) and I put it on my 3/8" dowel, do you think it would work for a good blunt hunting tip?
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Some more pictures of the two arrows
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Common term, is wire nut. Various styles, and brands and names. Should work. Try using upholstery thread, it is thinner, and strong, and makes for a neater wrap. Not bad at all though for the materials you have at hand. Keep at it, you will start fine tuning. It is time consuming, but like a good bow, take your time, it will come out fine. When you use the natural shafts, boo, shoots, etc. you want the thicker end for the point, and the thinner end for the nock. You can use an open end wrench for a measuring tool, to size your shafts when you go to cut them. for the boo, cut the second growth shoots, those with no culms, or dry, and dead culms. Other wise they will shrink, and wrinkle. Also no strength. Bundle them in lots of twelve or so, and wrap them well, and tightly, and put them in your attic or some dry warm place for a couple months or so, and take them out and look at them, if they are not dry, put them back. You can leave them there for more than a couple of months, if you want. But check them periodically for bug holes. Little $#$#@$!! beetles, like pine borers will bore a hole in them, and eat them from the inside out, and you will notice little holes, in the side, and real fine saw dust. they are ruined then. PUT THEM IN THE FIRE. You can put shafts in the sun, in your car, etc. and they will turn a nice yellow, to tan color. You straighten them, by heating them, but not too hot, or in one spot too long, or you will burn them. I use a Harbor Freight heat gun. Just keep moving the gun, and rotating the shaft. You can make a simple arrow straightener, out of a board, with a hole in it, or a limb, with a notch in it. A 2 X 4 cut with a half moon hump in the middle, and three or four inch sides like handles on each side of the hump. Then you can heat the shaft, and place the heated area on the hump and hold the shaft with some pressure on the hump, till it has cooled, and then look down the shaft, to see if the straightness has improved, and move on the the next spot that needs straightening, and leave the node section for last. Then when it is straight, you can sand the nodes, smooth, and even with the shaft. Some people recommend boring out the nodes. I do not! It weakens the arrow. the nodes are the weak spots of a boo shaft You can straighten the sections between the nodes, first, and then sand the nodes down, smooth, and you can use a spray can of lacquer to coat the entire shaft. They will be very nice looking, and the sanded nodes will be water proof. You can put a small dowel down in either end, and use it to hang the shaft, and spray it, and let it dry, then you can use four 0 steel wool to lightly sand it. You may have to put a couple of coats on it. You can sand the entire shaft if you want, but then seal it with lacquer. Some people use a pvc pipe, and put the lacquer in it, and dip the shaft in the lacquer, and then hang the shaft to dry. Which ever method works for you is the one to use. I use the spray can. There are many how to sections on here, and You Tube. Check them out, and you can see how other people do it. Nice first arrow. Now make a dozen more. Let us know how they fly.
Wayne
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So I shot them today and honestly they flew good some shots and then other shots i couldn't tell if it was me or the arrows. I guess i'm just learning still. What does tip weight affect? Because I don't have any tips yet until I order field points.
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tip weight if you have absolutely none will help to bring your shots closer together over father distances.(more noticeably anyway.) The greater the tip weight the deeper it should penetrate.
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Okay, thanks. So has anyone ever tried a seashell tip? Because I was at the beach today and was just laying around with the girlfriend and grabbed some shells for inlays, etc. I made a tip for an arrow and it came out pretty decent. Im wondering if it would break on impact though.
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It will probably break after one use is what im thinking. If its weaker than bone that's the most likely thing to happen. its also rather thin, so not durable. still effective for small game hunting though.
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Looks more like a hang on the wall type of arrow. haha.
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I think youre gunna need a beefy-er point. :-) shells probably going to be too chalky.
To make a penetrating point, the entire shaft tip itself will need to taper towards the point of impact.
hold your arrow up and turn it, and ask what might slow this arrow from penetrating a deer?
pitch can be useful for making a taper transition from stone to wood.
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A new sharks tooth will work. Most if what you find on the beach has been washing around in the sand a long time, but one fresh out of the sharks mouth and large enough will make a decent point.
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I just got a ducks wings from my backyard that I believe had been attacked by the turtles and I cut the wings off. I could use these as fletchings, correct? Do you guys have any experience with them?
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Duck feathers work quite well
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If my bow is center shot does spine have to be exact?
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Most people will say no, but on my 70 pound bow I've found that I can tell a huge difference in consistency and accuracy with properly spined arrows.
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I tried a different style and I seem to like it better. And saves feathers. I made another post to show other people but here it is.