Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Cardboard_Duck on December 12, 2012, 09:04:17 pm
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I roughed it out today and it is 66" tip to tip and about 5/8" thick. I am making it for my father-in-law for christmas. It is 1 3/4" at the fades and tapers to 1/2" right now. I decided to go with a pyramid style after reading about parallel and pyramid bows until my eyes hurt... Anyways I am shooting for around #40-45 @ 28". It was a really nice stave with some natural reflex and almost perfectly straight grain, but there was a knot and I hope I laid it out so it won't give me a problem...
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8359/8267545359_0aa83baef9_z.jpg)
I went around the knot... Can I just cut through it without weakening the handle? The center of the knot is on the edge of where the handle would be.
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8502/8268615186_3b852e260a_z.jpg)
I think I will have to kick the top limb over a pinch
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8358/8267545719_6c67de1d4c_z.jpg)
Natural reflex
Any comments, concerns, or constructive criticism are always welcome :)
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With that much depth in your handle I bet you could cut through it no problem. Hickory is mighty! The way you have your layout right now it means the width at mid limb is only 1 1/8". That's pretty narrow so you might not be able to get 40-45# without taking quite a bit of set. If you start getting a lot of set early then you may need to decide on a lighter draw weight.
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or accept a little bit more of set.
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That knot won't give you any problem where it's at on that deep handle. Just shave it off to the handle line an round the whole thing over.
So could a lighter bow with no set be as fast as a heavier bow with lots of set? Jus askin................ >:D
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I agree with you randman. I would cut the knot off and I would go for no more than 1" of set, meaning limbs end up pretty straight, and call it done, no matter the weight.
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So, I should have gone wider or with a parallel limb design? Oh well, learning is half the fun right :)
I'm not so worried about the weight, He has a bad shoulder and wrist so the lighter the better I guess.
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Don't worry so much about the set. Just get those limbs bending evenly at your draw weight/length preferred.
But yes, wider limbs=less set. I think for 40 pounds though 1 1/4 shouldnt take much set.
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Hey Duck,
Looks good so far. I agree with Ryoon also. Your handle looks thick enough and it appears you are doing a non-bendy handle that you could cut right through that knot. Or you might actually be able to shape it up and use it as the arrow shelf if you plan on putting one on it.
~Barry
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It may be fine for 40+ lbs., it depends on the stave, the moisture content, your patience in tillering, the final width, etc. I just finished an oak that was not nearly that long and it was pyramid and came in under 40 lbs. and it was no wider than that. So you have a real chance.
If it was a lefty I would say to work that knot down so it pokes out of the leather handle wrap and splits your fingers.....just for something different.
And I would say, no, to parallel; pyramid is the way to go.
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Agree with the rest on the handle, but think if you keep it dry in between workings and take your time tillering you can get the weight you want,I probably would have went a little longer for 28 draw you will only be 64 n-n but that should work with out to much set. I would first be sure he really draws 28,everyone says they do but in reality they don't. ;) :)We lay them out that way all the time. :)
Pappy
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Thanks for the advice everybody :)
He really only draws to about 26", I just want to tiller it out a little further for good measure.
Funny story about figuring out his draw. I knew if I came out and asked him what his draw length was he would get suspicious and know I was going to make him a bow. I had the inlaws over for dinner, had all of my bows set up ready to shoot and the arrows marked at 1" increments about 6" back from the insert. When he drew I just counted back marks and subtracted them from the arrow length.
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Don't get too obsessed with on set.
If the bow will sit on the floor with the belly side of of the grip touching the floor and the tips are only just about touching or are still off the floor that's fine.
On my bows (which don't have thick grips) I reckon to have the tips on the floor and a one or two finger gap between foor and grip as ok.
A little set can give a smooth shooting bow that's easier to string too.
Del
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I agree with Del on the set thing, Hickory is tough and if it was me and he draws 26 I would only tiller out to 27,that will help with the set,no reason to pull one more than it is going to be shot,at least that is what I think and do. :) I usuall tiller
mine out if it is for me to 26 then pull a few time to 27 just for a confident thing for me. :)
Pappy
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I disagree with everybody :P.....id cut that thang up into smoking chips,put em in some water to soak,grab a yard bird an inject it with some seasonings,and throw it all in the smoker >:D...mmm tasty smoked hickory chicken ;D id find much more enjoyment and pleasure in that 8)
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Man you are on a roll today Chris. ;) ;D ;D Does sound good tho. ;)
Pappy
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Well, I took blackhawks advice and ran it through a wood chipper and I am currently grilling dinner with whats left of the bow... :o
:) The handle is only roughed out and will not stay "that" thick. I'll just keep at it and post some pics when I'm done. I just wish I would have laid it out a little differently so I could have used that knot as an arrow rest.
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With the knot there make sure the handle doesn't bend especially if you cut through it. I'd leave it but it does look lie you can take about an 1/8" off. Jawge
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Don't you be roasting yard bird with that stick !!
It will make a nice bow ,and if the knot is sound ,as in no junk in it, and the handle is non bendy there is no reason to worry about cutting thru it !!
Now if it was that inferior Osage stuff ?!!!
Who wants to eat old dead birds anyway ?!!
Have fun !!
Guy
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I'm with Pappy on not tillering it much farther than he's going to draw. Alot of people think they draw farther than they do. I'm 6' tall and have pretty long arms, I anchor in the corner of my mouth and I typically draw about 26.5""-27". So that being the case I typically pull my bows to 27"-27.5" sometimes I'll pull it 5-10 times at 28". I just do that to give myself the confidence that if I would over draw for any reason, because I'm excited in the woods or whatever that the bow shouldn't snap on me. If he draws 26" I'd tiller it out to that, pull it to 27" 5-10 times and then just leave it.
~Barry
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I don't think I would be too worried about a knot in the handle, just so long as it stays out of the fades. I always just ignore em and do what I want to with it when its in the handle area of a stiff handled bow, but like I said, as long as its not in the fades. I would think you can get your draw weight with those dimensions. A little heat treatment might help knock down any set as well so long as your tiller is pretty even before you start stressing it too much. Danny
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I put on some tip overlays today and did a little scraping. Got it on the short string and worked it for a while. I am still undecided on what on want to do to the handle though.
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8488/8276354380_03224d3b8e_z.jpg)
I also straightened it a little, it might need a tad more...
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8360/8275288761_e85d31832d_z.jpg)
It still has some natural reflex :)
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8224/8276354114_1c18a15594_z.jpg)
I think I should make my weight (#40-45)... I hope.
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To quote Teddy Roosevelt on his first trip to Africa...."Safari so good!"
I've got high hopes for this bow.
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Well... After some "learning experiences" I am almost ready to put a finish on. I thought everything was going smoothly until for what ever reason it took some set. I was taking tillering slow and never pulled it passed my target weight, but I didn't heat treat the belly... and when I was tillering it was rather humid out.
So I flipped the tips :)
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8083/8294889925_21afca0379_z.jpg)
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8082/8294890263_83ebcbc756_z.jpg)
But they didn't want to stay... So, I put some underlays on. (first time trying this)
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8224/8294890105_9641b57ce4_z.jpg)
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8360/8294889595_14d4f42fe3_z.jpg)
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8501/8295940434_b4e3ca9605_z.jpg)
I put a little arrow pass in.
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8362/8295940702_0af9f279f0_z.jpg)
I still have to do some finish sanding, put on a handle wrap (thinking twisted jute) and seal it.
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Looks pretty smooth to me. Gonna be a beauty once it's sealed, I'm sure.
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I did some underlays on a working recurved hedge once with horn and it worked fine.I got in a hurry dry heating the recuves in and cracked it.I'm thinking you steamed the flip on the tips.If you would of heat tempered them later with the heat gun on your steaming form they would never have pulled out guarantee it.
If you get more familiar with using a heat gun you can do wonders with it on hickory.
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Judging from the pics it looks like it took set mostly around the middle third of the limb. As narrow as it is there it's no wonder it took set. With that taper you need to get the wood near the fades working more so the stress is more evenly distributed along the limb. Flipping tips will actually put more stress on the limb than before because you reduce the amount of working limb you had to begin with.
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I only used a heat gun for the bends and I did toast the underside of the curve on the tips, I just think there wasn't enough wood there to hold them in place.
I will take a few more scrapes near the fades to see if I can get them bending a bit more. This is my first time working with hickory and I have learned a lot from it, I', happy so far with this one though :)
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I like it. Ryoon was right from the get go, a bit narrow. I would get it bending closer to the fades, heat and straighten the limbs while tempering. Might improve it some. A little set is always acceptable to me. Some would argue preferable.
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(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8351/8296138521_e354d7c37c_z.jpg)
Tiller looks good to my inexperienced eyes
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Well I finished it, I hope he likes it...
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8218/8303058211_4de88beff5_c.jpg)
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8492/8304111912_e03bf1abdb_c.jpg)