Primitive Archer

Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Tilbilly on September 01, 2007, 07:12:52 pm

Title: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics (Tool Pics added on pg.6)
Post by: Tilbilly on September 01, 2007, 07:12:52 pm
 Here's a hornbow my Dad finished recently. He doesn't post but he "lurks" here. He's made a handful of backed boardbows, but he's always had a thing for horn and sinew bows of this design. Water Buff horn, deer sinew, ash, and hide glue. After alot of trial/error he's got one completed and took it for a stroll in the backyard. These are the pics he sent me so far. He layed down a little more sinew than he wanted, which made the poundage higher. Hence, he's not drawing fully (yet! )in this pic with thumb ring. He hasn't put it on the bow scale yet, but says it feels similar to his 60#@28" Browning Safari 'curve. The bow is going through some tweeking/adjusting as it reveals areas needing attention. That sinew stuff amazes me how it allows for changes and repairs after the bow is complete. For being on the cusp of his 70th b'day, I've gotta hand it to Dad for being able to build and haul back a bow like that. Pretty ferocious still.

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/TurkishHornBow.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/newhornbow.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/Archeryinthebackyard-05.jpg)
 
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Pat B on September 01, 2007, 07:16:15 pm
Very cool little bow. Congrats to Dad for a job well done! ;D   Pat
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Gordon on September 01, 2007, 07:20:18 pm
Wow, that bow really turned out nice. I'd love to make one of those someday - you're dad deserves a lot of credit for pulling it off.
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Badger on September 01, 2007, 07:32:00 pm
You have good reason to be proud of your pop, thats quite an accomplishment just to get the first one working, that bow looks great!! Your dad must stay in pretty good shape. Steve
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Tilbilly on September 01, 2007, 07:49:30 pm
Dad's a moldmaker/machinist by trade, so he has skills and problem-solving working in his favor. He's sorta quiet/humble, so I surprised him by posting this on a few websites. Seems most people BUY this style of bow if they want one. Often the 'glass versions. So it's a little unique and interesting to be able to show that somebody has tried their hand at making one. Dad's studied up on these bows and their history for quite a few years before getting around to any actual building. Sinew really amazes me. I've seen this bow appear ruined and then renewed with sinew, as well as CA glue in cracks. I remember one section of horn became problematic as well. So that got removed and replaced. The bow now appears, and shoots, like new. So I imagine he'll want to "purdy it up" next.
Maybe name it "Pheonix". He's already set aside materials for three more bows. My poor mother................LOL.

He doesn't work out, other than gardening and using a treadmill. Big arms and strong shoulders seem to be common in his family. I've pounded the iron since I was 12, but Dad seems to be able to pull back the same bows I can. Just a matter of keeping that going for another 40 years.......
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Kviljo on September 01, 2007, 09:02:14 pm
That's really awesome! I'm always amazed by the huge reflex they can withstand. Must be really fast 8)
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: DanaM on September 01, 2007, 09:16:41 pm
All I can say is awesome, heck of a bow by a heck of a guy.
Tell pops not to lurk as it is apparent he has some skills to pass on to us young uns. ;D
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Tilbilly on September 01, 2007, 09:28:17 pm

Kviljo, Dad says it screams an arrow fast. I haven't been present yet when he's shot it. Can't wait, though.
I've read that these bows are extremely efficient and really shine even when using an extremely heavy arrow.
He's got a chrony tucked away somewhere. Just a matter of hitting the chrony, I mean, the target  ;D
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: venisonburger on September 02, 2007, 01:10:39 am
I'm fascinated by those bows, the lines are really nice. Your Dad did a great job.
VB
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Justin Snyder on September 02, 2007, 01:15:49 am
Cool hornbow...   You better make sure you are taking lessons from your pa.  Justin
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: medicinewheel on September 02, 2007, 04:29:55 am

now   T H A T is a hornbow!  very nice! it's turkish style, right?!
congrats to your dad for bow and birthday,
frank
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: medicinewheel on September 02, 2007, 04:34:00 am

ps: think your dad would share some details?? - did he splice the siyahs? what did he use for siyahs?? messurements maybe??????
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Marc St Louis on September 02, 2007, 09:29:12 am
Very nice bow. Don't see horn bows being made very often
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Tilbilly on September 02, 2007, 09:53:46 am
Kinda wish he would post. Saves me some typing. And he could 'splain better. Heck, he was into Primitive Archer and the website for quite some time before I clued in and started making an effort to learn from y'all. Personally, I'm still trying to get a backed board to cooperate with me.

Not sure whether I'll attempt one of these bows someday, but I'm fascinated  regardless.
All the wood used is white ash from a local wood mill. I remember him starting with maple and having troubles. But that was probably due to the learning process and not the wood. The siyas are spliced in.

This posting seems to have generated some interest ('til deer season starts  ;) ), so I'll email Pa for more pics. He mentioned in the past that he took, and saved, more. Would be nice to see different stages of progress. He has a new digital, his old was really an oldy. So the pics won't be as good as the ones above. But........
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Hillbilly on September 02, 2007, 09:57:53 am
Mighty fine looking hornbow, not many of us would have the patience to tackle a project like that. Looks like he's got a nice patch of arrow cane, too. Dad, quit lurking and talk to us!  :)
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Pappy on September 02, 2007, 12:30:33 pm
Sweet looking bow,congrats to Dad on a mighty fine looking job. :)
    Pappy
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: huntersim on September 02, 2007, 12:44:40 pm
Neat bow, he did a good job.
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Tilbilly on September 02, 2007, 01:58:59 pm
Ya the cane is kinda interesting thing too. We're in southwestern Ontario, and there's no such thing as cane here. He ordered it online a few years ago from someplace in B.C. Cane, giant 'boo, and another kind I forget. It all needs to be covered in mulch and plastic sheeting to make it through our winter. This year the cane sent up a few shoots just large enough for arrows. Next year maybe I'll see Dad flinging a few of those. Just a matter of keeping the cottontails away from the tender young shoots. The giant 'boo is doing well and can stand cold to -20C, but it will never get thick enough 'round here to use it for backing a bow.
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Marc St Louis on September 02, 2007, 06:40:00 pm
Tilbillly
There's a place around Orillia that has started selling Bamboo. I'll stop and see them the next time I am down that way
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: a finnish native on September 02, 2007, 07:16:03 pm
how long did it take for him to make this bow? and how many layers of sinew did he apply? how long drying periods? sorry for all the questions ::)
Very nice work. I have shot one of those monstrers once. I have to say that the are FAST. I mean about 250 fps!
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Tilbilly on September 02, 2007, 07:49:32 pm
Marc, been admiring your work for quite some time. I'll click the email button a little later to ask a few 'boo questions.

Got an email from Pa just after lunchtime. Gave me flack in a comical way for drawing attention to him  :D  It's the kinda guy he is. He/Ma are visiting people today, so I,m hoping he gets on the 'puter tonight and tells a little more than I'm capable of. I do know the bow has been worked on, on/off for a year or more. There's drying time for sinew, wife going through hip replacement, grandkids being dropped off for unpaid babysitting.... retirement's a busy time LOL!

Also, these bows require projects within the project. For example, he made a tool from hardwood(got pics Dad?)  that allows for a firm wrapping of the cord (pic above). That tool works so well that if you aren't careful it will crush your project. He found plans for, and made , a board with several pegs and holes that allows you to pull back the limbs to various stages of brace so you can inspect the tiller as well as string the beast more easily. You can't use a twist string on these bows, so I pointed out a nifty set of plans on another website for making an endless loop string. So he made all that, too. And now I have a source for endless strings heh heh.

I'd try to answer more questions but I'll wait to see if Pa starts posting. Maybe tonight? I'm not even sure what handle he is registered with on here. He did say in his email that he shot the bow more today and loves the smooth draw and quietness. He's using a ring and says no armgaurd needed that way, just like people claim.

Might have to put in my order for one. I have an SKB 50 I pull out once in awhile but shoot it fingers.
No problems in the past but lately I've developed a sore knuckle from the string angle. I'm turning 40 this winter, that's why  :(  So it's either learn the ring, or see about a longer bow in this style?
O.K. 'nuff 'bout me. Where's Pa?  ;D

Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Dane on September 02, 2007, 11:23:29 pm
Tillybilly, you are going to get tons of questions to relay through your dad, so have him come on if he can :) I've got one of these bows on the blocks, my osage core is finally finished, and I had to rescue some sinew from my pug today. Just finding the time is so hard anymore. An excuse, eh? Frank (medicinebow) also has one of these bows in the works, as well.

What I'd be most interested in is dimensions, including thickness of sinew layer, thickness of wood core, ear dimensions, what kind of horn he used, and overall length of bow.

Thanks,
Dane

Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: welch2 on September 02, 2007, 11:28:55 pm
Very nice bow ,your dad is talented.Looking forward to more pictures and details ,myself.
Thanks for posting it.

Ralph
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: 1/2primitive on September 02, 2007, 11:35:56 pm
That's a beauty, I hope to get there some day, but I think it'll be a while.  :P
     Sean
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Ekwos on September 03, 2007, 01:00:29 am
Where's Pa?Right here ,son.Hi everyone , guess I'll have to chime up now since Tilbilly posted the hornbow pics.The whole thing is really not all that hard,just a lot of fiddling around.
I believe Tilbilly Thinks that I made several attempts with the project but this is still my one and only
hornbow.Made a few corrections along the way,all needed because of my ignorance,but the bow survived.  The core is five pieces of white ash, handle , two arms and two siyahs/tips.All v spliced.
Belly covered with waterbuff horn from good old Peter Cua and theback is deer sinew.Used Knox gelatine as glue on everything.Dimentions are a bit vague right now but I've got another one on paper all dimentioned out.It will be a couple of inches shorter than this one ,present one being 48" nock to nock along the belly.
Thickness of horn is appr. 3/16" , wood is about the same and overall thickness of the arms is .600" tapering to .500" at the start of the siyahs.That sinew is plenty thick.Width is appr. 1 1/4" mostly parrallel with the last 2" tapered to 1" at the base of the tips.Any details or what ever you all want to ask , don't be shy like me.Guys, thank you for all the positive comments,it means a lot.And thanks Tilbilly,son.
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: a finnish native on September 03, 2007, 04:48:25 am
could we maybe get some detail photos of the handle area, midlimb and the tips? it would mean a lot. thanks
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: DanaM on September 03, 2007, 07:27:22 am
Heck of a a way to make an appearance Ekwos, or should we just call ya Pa ;D That sure is one
heck of a bow you built and I'm sure the guys are going to have more questions.
Welcome aboard.
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Tilbilly on September 03, 2007, 09:15:58 am
Now I can sleep better tonight  ;D  8)
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: welch2 on September 03, 2007, 02:16:44 pm
Did you groove the horn and the core prior to glue up?
And do you have any close up pictures of the handle and siyahs ?

Ralph
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Ekwos on September 03, 2007, 02:18:15 pm
Tilbilly must have gone back to bed.Sent him some pics of the bow's start.There are more,just what you asked for Finish Native.The whole thing took 2 years but total hours are not that bad,maybe 40 hrs . In general there are about 6 layers of sinew on the arm area.More at the grip fade area.That needs a good buildup . There is a bit of a buildup at the siyah area along the sides to make that a more or less triangular cross section.Going to try and make that lighter on the next one.Looking for Tilbilly to send in some pictures so there can be some more comments. Pa
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Rich Saffold on September 03, 2007, 02:40:11 pm
Hey Pa,  Your bow looks great!, and fast as well.
Rich
Title: Re: New Hornbow Pics
Post by: Tilbilly on September 03, 2007, 03:06:41 pm
Here's s'more pics sent from Ekwos( Dad )that will help answer more questions. We live 1/2hr apart, so I'll show him how to download his own pics when I see him next.

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/horn2.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/horn3.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/horn4.jpg)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: welch2 on September 03, 2007, 10:52:55 pm
Did you lay the sinew down as one big layer ,or several layers?

Ralph
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Ekwos on September 04, 2007, 02:19:16 am
Hi Ralph.They were laid down in several layers till I had the thickness that I thought right in the bending section (too thick) as it turned out
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: OldBow on September 04, 2007, 01:47:46 pm
Good Grief. Some people have all the talent.  Kudus to your father for his skill. Got this fine bow bookmarked for Backed Bow of the Month for September, too.
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Tilbilly on September 05, 2007, 05:31:29 pm
Looks like the TBB's were a great idea for a retirement gift from your family...........

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/horn5.jpg)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Tilbilly on September 05, 2007, 05:32:32 pm
(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/horn8.jpg)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Tilbilly on September 05, 2007, 05:35:03 pm
Figgered a view of the horn,plus more construction stuff, wouldn't hurt.
Horn and sinew added. Sinew is drying. Definitely a high-stress affair.

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/horn9.jpg)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 05, 2007, 07:51:01 pm
A picture is worth a thousand words, most definately this time. Thanks to both of you for taking the time to post. Very informative! I found the length of the ears (sirahs) surprising, and the v splices are well illustrated.

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Kviljo on September 05, 2007, 09:52:02 pm
Again, that is simply incredible! When you're used to all wood bows, seeing that reflex is just stunning! 8)
How much of that reflex did it hold after curing, and did it loose any after being shot in?
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Ekwos on September 05, 2007, 10:40:58 pm
Thanks for the comments guys.Kviljo,the reflex continued after that last pic so that the siyahs were side by side . I t didn't need a string to hold it in place. Kept on tightening the string while the sinew was contracting.After curing used a spreader after first warming the bow , then let it sit for a few days.It was opened up far enough to put the what they call tepeliks .You tie them in the position where the hinges go that will determine the shape and that the limbs will bend mainly in these areas.They will also bend in the area just in front of the siyahs .After all that it goes  on the tillering board and goes to the first pegs.A couple of days later to the next and so on.Each time it needs to be warmed up.Tillering is not the same as with a selfbow.If you were careful and made all the components equal, It should come in halfway decent .If one limb is a bit stiff then it needs some heat applied and over bent in the stiff area.Eventually it will come in.If you keep the bow in a warming box,much of the reflex will come back.More pic on the way to explain some of this stuff.The next bow will be more fully documented.Cut my teeth on this one. Eppo I mean , Ekwos
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Jbell on September 06, 2007, 01:29:33 am
I am absolutely facsinated by Turkish and other horn bows as well. Thanks a ton for all the information you have givin us. If I can ask, where did you obtain the information for building this bow. I have researched these type of bows before but there is not alot of info out there, unless I am looking in the wrong place. Btw, your bow is amazing!
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: a finnish native on September 06, 2007, 04:49:42 am
http://198.170.108.27/phpBB2/index.php try to lurk around there
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Ekwos on September 08, 2007, 09:36:58 pm
Tilbilly( Al ) here on Ekwos' s (Pa' s, Dad' s, Eppo' s ) ' puter. Got to see the horniferous beast in action at Pa' s backyard. Quite the bow. We got it on the Hanson scale and it came to about 75#@28" !!!  I'm no small boy, but I could tell it was heavy duty shooting it before we scaled it.
Moves an arrow with authority and at 15 yards I was within 2" of bullseye for 3 consecutive shots.
It pulls smoothly but I'm especially impressed with the quietness. Imagine the quietest longbow you' ve encountered. That quiet. Needs absolutely no string silencers. I like how this design needs no string bridges. Just one more thing to damage if it became a hunting bow IMHO.
Hope to get a few more pics of hornbow related stuff this week.
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 09, 2007, 10:47:05 am
I was curious about the bridge issue.

How about protecting the sinew back? I know snakeskin and birch bark have been used with some Asiatic designs. Maybe I just can't tell in the shots, but any comments about that?

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Ekwos on September 09, 2007, 01:24:21 pm
Dane,there isn't any backing on her yet.I'm debating whether to just paint or to go with birchbark.So far,with aircond. and all things are fine but it is going to get finished for sure.Iwas amazed at the draw weight.Couldn't shoot it my self and had to let Tilbilly do the shooting.I shot it too much last week and kind of wrecked my shoulder,just didn't realize just how strong the bow really is.Retraining my arm now.Eppo Ekwos. ps A Turkish style bow doesn't need string bridges.Perhaps if the tips don't recurve enough then bridges would be in order.
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: makete on September 10, 2007, 11:35:43 am
Awsome bow!!!!!!!!!!!! Love the pics, just wish there were more ;D. Keep us informed please. And welcome, you will be an asset to us newbies. Thank you again.
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: jcougar on September 10, 2007, 06:18:54 pm
Did you steam bend the pieces for the siyahs, or cut them to that shape?
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Ekwos on September 10, 2007, 07:28:16 pm
Jcougar, the siyahs and tips are steam bent and one piece.At about 45 deg.s .There is another 45 bend just before the siyahs,both at 8" rads.
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 10, 2007, 09:10:11 pm
Thanks for the reply, Ekwos.

Suppose you had not steamed in the bends at all, but just let the sinew and the curve of the siyahs take care of that? I'm debating how much recurve I want, considering the challenges of just bracing this kind of bow - not really into making a Turkish replica, as well.

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Ekwos on September 11, 2007, 12:40:18 am
Dane,that's about what Tilbilly has in mind too.A generic hornbow.Just keep it short so the sinew can work properly.Ekwos
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 11, 2007, 02:08:15 am
Dane,there isn't any backing on her yet.I'm debating whether to just paint or to go with birchbark.So far,with aircond. and all things are fine but it is going to get finished for sure.Iwas amazed at the draw weight.Couldn't shoot it my self and had to let Tilbilly do the shooting.I shot it too much last week and kind of wrecked my shoulder,just didn't realize just how strong the bow really is.Retraining my arm now.Eppo Ekwos. ps A Turkish style bow doesn't need string bridges.Perhaps if the tips don't recurve enough then bridges would be in order.

Take care of yourself. Archery is supposed to be fun, not a way to produce casualties.

Regarding the bow I've got in the works, I saw some nice papyrus (spell?) at an art store a while back, and that might look cool. I watched the 4-hour Korean horn bow video, and that bowyer used birchbark imported from either Japan or China, and it had been soaked in salt water for something like a year. The other video I watched recommends birchbark (Schmitd), but he cautions not to introduce moisture when you put it on.

Oh, regarding the lenght, yup, going to keep it relatively short. I'm using the bone ear stiffeners found at Bar Hill, a Roman military site, as the point of departure for the rest of the bow. The stiffner is only 5.25" or so long, which suprised me when I measured it. I figure ash will be a good choice for the ears, and osage is what my core is made from, all planed and ready to go.

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 11, 2007, 02:11:45 am
Oh, one more question if I can, and I hope this is not dumb. I was wondering why you chose to splice the handle the way you did? My impression is that you can glue a handle to one long core strip of wood.

Thanks,

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Loki on September 11, 2007, 03:35:07 am
Dane are you making a Hamian Archers Bow? this one was made by one of the reenactors on the RAT Forums,what a beauty!
(http://img458.imageshack.us/img458/9175/img6348on6.th.jpg) (http://img458.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img6348on6.jpg)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 11, 2007, 08:01:08 am
Hi Loki. Not exactly, mine will eventually end up here, unless disaster strikes. :)

Could you post the thread, or just let me know which topic thread on RAT this bow is on?

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Loki on September 11, 2007, 11:57:58 am
Salve Dane,
             The guy who made the bow is the 11'th poster in this thread,enjoy!..
http://www.romanarmy.nl/rat/viewtopic.php?t=16320&highlight=hamian+archers&sid=f4709b5f0d9dd962f39e352177465c1a
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 11, 2007, 01:47:32 pm
Salve, Loki, and thanks! So, it is a "real" composite, vs. the Grozer (or whoever) fiberglass "horse bows."

The shame is so little is know about Roman military bows vs. other periods. We need a Roman Mary Rose find! The Nydam ship find is good, though, for "enemy" self bows.

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Ekwos on September 11, 2007, 11:34:54 pm
Dane,there are no dumb questions.Sure,you can glue the handle onto a straight slat.Was done in the past and is being done now.My handle started out as a 14" piece spliced into the arms with 5" splices but that is the hard way.Got to really watch to keep it all lined up.5 pieces all together.
Am tempted to start one of the Hun type bows too.They look cool. Just tried and can almost come to a full draw again,just start slow.No permanent damage done.Ekwos
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Loki on September 12, 2007, 03:54:57 am
Quote
it is a "real" composite, vs. the Grozer (or whoever) fiberglass "horse bows."

Aye,his bow is made from the correct materials whilst the Grozer and Kassai bows have a fibreglass lam hidden in there somewhere.But it's reflected in the price,
the bow in the picture is for sale for over £1000 whilst the Grozer/Kassai  'copy's' are around £200.

Loki
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 12, 2007, 07:41:47 am
Dane,there are no dumb questions.Sure,you can glue the handle onto a straight slat.Was done in the past and is being done now.My handle started out as a 14" piece spliced into the arms with 5" splices but that is the hard way.Got to really watch to keep it all lined up.5 pieces all together.
Am tempted to start one of the Hun type bows too.They look cool. Just tried and can almost come to a full draw again,just start slow.No permanent damage done.Ekwos

Glad to hear you are okay. And yes, the hun bows are cool. Most composite designs are cool, actually.

Thanks for all this. It has motivated me to get back to my composite. Just a bit chicken, I guess. :)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 12, 2007, 07:43:51 am
Quote
it is a "real" composite, vs. the Grozer (or whoever) fiberglass "horse bows."

Aye,his bow is made from the correct materials whilst the Grozer and Kassai bows have a fibreglass lam hidden in there somewhere.But it's reflected in the price,
the bow in the picture is for sale for over £1000 whilst the Grozer/Kassai  'copy's' are around £200.

Loki

Salve on this damp morning. Yup, you do get what you pay for, however. And, the square quiver is very cool, I assume inspired from the Trajan column.

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: George Tsoukalas on September 12, 2007, 09:04:51 am
Ekwos, that is just an incredible bow Congratulations on a job well done. Jawge
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Ekwos on September 12, 2007, 01:00:25 pm
Thanks everyone,just a beginner tho.I'm still tweaking the lower limb with heat (hair dryer,just good and warm,not hot) . It is still a bit stiffer than the upper altho it needs to be stronger but could be less than it is.Keep going Dane and you'll have a hornbow in time,Ekwos
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Tilbilly on September 12, 2007, 05:21:15 pm
Thanks everyone,just a beginner tho.

.....and did I mention that Dad's humble. Don't let him fool you, though. He's alot smarter than I look  ;)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 13, 2007, 07:59:12 am
We are both lucky to have you two guys here.

Just do it, Ekwos, eh? I was out eyeing the wooden core last night, so back to it I will go. The worst I can do is not try, and the best I can do is make a good horn bow. Funny how when you go out side your "comfort zone" the trepidation sets in. It does for me, in any case.

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Ekwos on September 13, 2007, 02:34:43 pm
Dane , if you only knew how long I was trepidated.............It started with my dad telling me about a hornbow a family member had hanging in the hallway and explaining how they were made,I was maybe 9 yrs old at the time.It kind of always stuck with me.Then,getting a computer,I saw a forum where a member was taken through all the details step by step.this was mid 90 s .Made up my mind to go ahead then and it was only a matter of getting the materials.Step by step and a lot of pondering before each step.So go on ahead and build that bow .Ekwos .
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Dane on September 13, 2007, 04:31:56 pm
Thanks for the encouragement! Okay, just do it. This coming weekend is booked, but next week, I will get to cutting and steaming the Asian water buffalo horn set aside for the bow and start fashioning the ears.

Dane
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(and more added)
Post by: Tilbilly on September 14, 2007, 07:59:21 pm
Pa took some pics of his stringing/tillering board from the dark reaches of his lab. Any questions, he'll chime in. I hope you gentlemen REALLY enjoy these as I was "visiting" Pa at the time and he actually made me hold off on precious boo-backed ipe work in order to take pics  >:(

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/board1.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/board2.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/board3.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/board4.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/board5.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/board6.jpg)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: Dane on September 15, 2007, 12:05:17 am
Tillybilly, those are great, and the board is exactly the same one used by Jeffery Schmidt in the asiatic bow building DVD. I highly recommend it. I re-watched it this morning, and am really psyched to get mine out of the corner and back on the bench. And between your dad's bow and the video, I sorted out some sticking points that were giving me knots.

Dane

Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: Tilbilly on September 15, 2007, 08:42:34 am
I sorted out some sticking points that were giving me knots.



Dane, it was worth it just to know that!
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: 1/2primitive on September 22, 2007, 09:54:03 pm
Man! I can just hope to get there.....all I can say is wow.  :o
     Sean
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: Beleg813 on September 22, 2007, 10:46:09 pm
That's a beautiful bow Ekwos :) Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: sonny on September 23, 2007, 11:42:29 am
is there a reason that the bend seems concentrated to what we would refer to as the fades ?? seems to me that it would be better to have the limbs bend more at mid-limb .
!!! with no intention of sounding like I know anything other than the basics of constructing a hornbow !! and certainly no intention of making fun of your bow !!!!
 
 
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: Ekwos on September 23, 2007, 04:27:20 pm
Thanks guys.Sonny,that is the way Turkish style hornbows bend.The bends are what you would call hinges,bad in a selfbow,good in a hornbow.The sinew and horn can take the abuse.Those same bends could be a little farther out on the limbs,maybe another inch.They are not where the fades are tho,just would not be able to bend in that area.The limbs also bend further down .When you haul 'er back that area straightens out nicely, adding to the cast.Shot her this morning and man,she is fast.
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: Kviljo on September 25, 2007, 12:16:03 am
I've just been going through this thread once more, admiring the bow 8)

Does the horn have uniform thickness along the limbs? - and approx. how many sinews did you use on the whole bow?
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: Ekwos on September 25, 2007, 12:38:27 am
Kviljo,the horn is par.all the way except about under the last half of the siyahs , the it is tapered so at the end you can almost see through it.The sinew is about 5.5mm on the arms with a slight taper to near where the siyahs start.Ekwos
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: Kviljo on September 25, 2007, 10:20:33 am
Thanks! I'll be roughing out a pair of horns today then :)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: stickbender on September 27, 2007, 12:40:35 am
     Man, you guys are tearing me up.  I do want a horn bow, or aisian style bow.  thought I might try to make one, one day, but instead of jumping into the horn and sinew, I thought I would try a laminate and fiberglass first.  Then, when I felt bold and froggy enough to jump into the fray, I would try to make a real aisan style, or turkish bow.  Tell your Father, he is a craftsman.
You are lucky to have that much knowledge, and skill, in your family, and still available.

                                                                           Stickbender
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: Tilbilly on October 01, 2007, 07:52:12 pm
Ekwos the hornbowyer sent me some more pics today. These are 2 tools he used in the bowmaking process. He made each of these tools. The first tool pictured is a "stringwalker"( meat tenderizer looking thingy  :P )  made of hardwood and is used to firmly wrap cord around the bow after horn has been glued on. Different views are shown here to get a good look at how it's shaped.
Overtightening can result in the cord crushing the project. The tool is THAT effective. The pic of the cord wrapped bow is on pg.1 .

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/tool2d.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/tool2c.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/tool2b.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/tool2.jpg)
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5)
Post by: Tilbilly on October 01, 2007, 08:09:06 pm
The other tool is a "setting mound", or "Tepelik", in Turkish. The high point on the Tepelik is placed where you want to make a bend, or hinge, on the arm of the bow. Then pressure is applied.

A coupla sidenotes:
- Ekwos says people can feel free to contact him for info. on making these tools.
And he says these tools aren't vital. C-clamps and wood blocks can be used, for example, in place of a Tepelik.
-Another hornbow project has been started. This time he'll take pics and document each step (can you say build-along? ). Then he'll post this on PA. He says he's not making this one for any contest. Just simply to encourage others to try their hand at it, it doesn' t take a genius. If you can make a wood bow, you can just as easily make a hornbow.

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/tool1.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/tool1b.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d54/dadz/tool1c.jpg)


Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics(string/tiller board pg.5, tool pics pg.6)
Post by: Tilbilly on October 01, 2007, 08:25:40 pm
I've suggested separate buildalongs for the dedicated tools used. Ekwos doesn't have an entire machine shop at his disposal, but just a few select pieces of equipment can be handy. I think he used his drill press to do alot of the work on the stringwalker. And as he wanted me to mention, there's a way around doing things without making special tools. So don't get intimidated by that.
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics (Tool Pics added on pg.6)
Post by: Jesse on October 01, 2007, 10:51:06 pm
What a great bow. I knew I didnt have a shot once I saw that thing. Great job. :)
                                                             Jesse
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics (Tool Pics added on pg.6)
Post by: Tilbilly on October 01, 2007, 11:18:19 pm
What a great bow. I knew I didnt have a shot once I saw that thing. Great job. :)
                                                             Jesse

Regardless of the outcome, they are all winning bows. And even the ones not nominated, in my opinion. Personally I'm still working on making my first successful wood longbow. Work and family commitments
make it hard to find the time. So I look up to you people churning out excellent bows. Pa and I were just saying tonight we're both shocked at the response. I posted his bow to surprise him, and figgered on a few nods. Seeing it nominated, I told him he'd just earned a nice memory/keepsake to go along with that bow.
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics (Tool Pics added on pg.6)
Post by: Jesse on October 01, 2007, 11:26:19 pm
This is a great site isnt it. You get a pat on the back from just about everyone here.
                                                                          Jesse
Title: Re: "Ekwos" New Hornbow Pics (Tool Pics added on pg.6)
Post by: Belabear on October 02, 2007, 04:35:41 pm
wow!

I shot hungarian bows a while and they are smooth to draw and really fast, no comparison to a bend stick of an elb, but i stayed with the elb at the end.

i always thought about getting  a real hornbow, but will never be able to afford on (1000 $ minimum) so i“ll continue to dream about it!

that“s an fantastic one!

congrats!

belabear