Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: beetlebailey1977 on November 03, 2010, 09:47:21 pm
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Does any body have some personal experience with this? I have a stave I cut and sealed then spilt. I cut it extra long to be safe and I took the bark off of it. Planning on making this my 1st attempt at a bow from a stave. I may get to post a pic later of it. Appreciate any tips or help offered. Thanks :)
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theres a couple people on here that has made bows from cedar.
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Love ERC. Easy to work, smells great, and looks fabulous. I have made mine a little wide and I leave a little bit of sap wood on the back. I also have backed all mine with rawhide.
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What nugget said and saw a great one made with all sapwood. Just start out about an 1 3/4" to 2" at the fades and slowly taper it till the last 1/4 of the limb.
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planning on at least 2" wide or so and 68" long. Need to follow the rings on the back rite? Rawhide or sinew is what I have been told.
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Rawhide is ideal for ERC. It is relatively light but very strong. I like the look of a rawhide backing too. It can also be decorated easily if desired.
I don't think you need to be 2" wide for a 68" bow. If your draw is 28" you can probably get away with 1 1/2" at the fades. ERC makes a good ELB style bow too.
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I've got an ERC sapling bow that I'm just finishing up (64"ntn, 55lbs @ 28"). I used the first ring under the cambium for the back, no backing. Like Nugget said it works easy, smells and looks good. It's 1 7/8" at the fades and tapers to 1" at the tips. It could probably be a little narrower at the tips, but I'm pretty new at this and I'd rather have a slightly overbuilt bow than 2 sticks.
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I've made several bows out of 'Cedar". I've used collected staves of Colorado red cedar (Very close relative of ERC) and lumber yard ERC. I think it makes fine bows, and the cured wood smells great. A good clear stave will make a self bow. I've treated it as a "white" wood and used the layer under the bark as the back. Others on this forum have suggested removing some or all of the sapwood. On most staves, that will make a prettier bow as more of the colored heartwood is left in the bow. Junipers, in general, are weak in tension, so you may want to back your bow. Backing will be necessary if there are flaws in the back. I have successfully used sinew, ash, hickory and bamboo. Silk is also a possibility. Rawhide is favorite for others.
ERC is not a very dense wood, so bows will typically be made a little wider than you might do for heavier woods.
Ron
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Hey yall Thanks for the help. I actually draw 30" so I want to over build it. The bow has a twist where the handle will be but the tips come back in line with each other. It is a clear stave as it came from the interior of a multi trunk tree. I may not back it and I might use rawhide will have to decide when I get there. :)
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Be careful if using power tools, ERC dust can be pretty nasty stuff.
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In my experience (and reading), the sapwood is good in tension, and the heartwood is good in compression, not unlike yew. So an all sapwood bow tends to take set, and an all heartwood bow tends to explode. In fact, ERC bows in general want to explode. And when they go, look out! I've made a few ERC selfbows that have survived, but if you want to make a hunting-weight bow, it's safest to back it.
If the heart/sap transition doesn't meander too much in your stave, you should try to leave a thin layer of sapwood for the backing. Follow the grain, especially if you don't back it. This is tricky with ERC, just be gentle and use good lighting, and you can follow the grain.
It's very difficult to introduce any significant bending from steam or heat, so don't plan on that.
I love ERC, in spite of (or maybe because of) its challenges. It grows like weeds here, it's easy to work, looks georgeous, light in the hand, and makes a very zippy bow. Good luck!
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I've made three of them. Two exploded, all me, and one hangs permanently braced on the wall of my friends hunting camp. It only pulled fifteen pounds. These were some of my early efforts, and I would like to try ERC again, only as others have suggested using a rawhide backing, or maybe Ash.
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every ERC self bow i have worked on has exploded unless soaked in water (see the bow gigging post). So if you make a hunting version am I right to understand you leave some sap wood on and make the limb wider? what design pyramidal or propeller-esque?
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if i remember right
someone a short while back posted a beautiful erc bow
it was wide,i think pyramid style,excellent tiller
just gorgeous looking wood for a bow
but never used it so know idea how well it works
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Ok well I plan to start roughing it out more this week. I plan to leave most of the sap wood as it is and just scrape it down some. Should I try to follow the grain on the sides or does it matter? I plan to rawhide back it.
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x460/beetle_bailey1977/cedarstave.jpg)
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On backing with rawhide....would Titebond 3 work well?
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I prefer the titebond (both II and III) over hide glue as it is not as slippery...it gets tacky faster and allows you to pull the rawhide tight as you wrap down the length of the limbs.
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ERC, like a couple other woods, tends to be a little oiley. Be sure to wipe it down with denatured alcohol or acetone before applying your rawhide.
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Excellent answers..ERC needs to be backed for a hunting weight bow..will be light as a feather in hand...sinew and ERC just seem to go together...rawhide is IMO the next option...remove bark ..there is your back..do not try to chase a ring..unnecessary...you must follow the grain on the side regardless whether you back it......can't wait to see it finished ..good luck hope its a screamer...gut
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Good tips fellows....Thanks a lot. :)
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Planning on getting some update photos on here of this bow. Hope to this week.
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marc st louis has made an excellent ERC Warbow(120lbs i think) you can check it out on the englishwarbow section of this forum
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If your sap wood is punky, or otherwise compromised, you will want to get rid of it. You can chase a ring from end to end as I did with this one. Actually chased two rings, as the stave had enough wood to yield two bows. Both of which will get deer rawhide backings.
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I am keeping the sapwood, just going to thin it down some then plan to back it with rawhide. Roughed it in some more today. The bow will be 68" long and 2 1/4" wide. The last 10" of the tips will taper down to the nocks. Would pin nocks work on the cedar?
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Hi Beetle, Yes pin nocks will work on cedar. Since cedar does split easily you might want to wrap just below the shoulders of the nock with thread, or sinew. Ron
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I may put on some tip overlays when I get to that step. Would you put down the rawhide up to the overlays or under them? I may use antler or hickory.
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I'd lay the rawhide out over the tips and then lay the overlays over the rawhide, be sure to degrease the rawhide by washing with a little soapy water and/or acetone before glueing anything onto it.