Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: NTD on February 28, 2010, 01:40:43 am
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I don't know how I manage to make a bow that shoots considering how difficult it is for me to do the little things. I just finsihed up my first R/D BBI, it's on the table with it's 4th coat of Tru-Oil drying, and although overall I'm happy with it there are little things I screw up that ruin the whole package. One of those is nocks. I can't file an even pair of nocks to save my life. Every bow the grooves have been at the very least at slightly different angles. I can not make them look nice...I can get them to function, barely, Usually when I sting my bows I have to readjust one side of a loop to stay on the bow. I've been using a rattail file, not sure if there is a better option. It's just a little frustrating to see all these beautiful bows with nice tip overlays and gracefully carved nocks that are even ::) Anyone else had this struggle and if so what did you do to overcome it? Should I just cut a buch of small pieces of wood and practice filing nocks? LOL....
P.S. Will post pics of the R/D BBI tomorrow, despite the nock trouble it sure was fun building.
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do you color inside of the lines??
lol jk but do you draw a line on the side from the back to the belly and follow that??
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Should I just cut a buch of small pieces of wood and practice filing nocks? LOL....
Actually... that's what I was going to suggest while I was reading your post :)
There may be a mathematical or engineering based formula for achieving perfect matching nocks... but if there isn't, then maybe careful practice, practice, practice might be the best option...?
Best of luck with your next nocks (that's not easy to say quickly ;)) and looking forward to seeing the pic's
Steve.
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Assuming you are overlaying your tips, here is what I do. First get the tips shaped and rounded. Then make a small groove in the center of the overlay. From there work down each side a little bit being careful to cut both sides at the same angle. Go slow and careful and check each side for symmetry frequently. There is no sliver bullet, it takes patience and practice.
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Make a jig, then make sure all your tips are the same so the jig works on them all? Alternatively, draw your notches out with a pencil, then follow them with the corner of a triangular rat tail file so that when you start with the round file it doesn't wander.
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I feel your pain, it does require some patience and practice.
I start with the tillering nocks as small as I can get 'em to allow for adjustment.
As some have suggested, a jig may help...
or here's an idea, once you have a shallow groove on one side, tape a cocktail stick or sliver of wood into the groove, so that when you turn the bow over the line of the nock is still visible.
Any excuse for a Martini ::)
I tend to end up with somewhat personal style of nock, probably as a carry over from my crossbow making days. Some of those fancy longbow horn nocks get a bit over the top, like darned great chess men stuck on the end of the bow. :o
Del
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I don't make wood or bamboo backed bows nor do I do overlays unless I have to but there are some buildalongs on my site which show how I make nocks for selfbows. Don't feel badly though I've been known to cut nocks backwards. :) Jawge
http://georgeandjoni.home.comcast.net/~georgeandjoni/
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First I lay out my nock groove lines with a sharp pencil. I then take a hacksaw blade with masking tape wrapped round half of it for a handle and saw three light passes on the nock groove lines. The saw kerf then guides my 1/4" chainsaw file for the nock grooves. Without a starting saw kerf I'd be all over the place.
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I was gonna do some pics of this the other day and figure...nah! Wished I would have now.
The easiest way I have found : File your first groove,at what ever angle you choose,(as all bows are different), then go to the other side,lay you file in the groove you just did and see the angle.mark that angle with a pencil,and start your file. File a bit and check your progress by simply alternating your file from the groove you are filing to the one you just did.
Or just leave a file in the first groove and use as a pattern. Very easy to file your second groove when you have a pattern to follow.
Give it a try ;)
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Someone on here, I think Eric, had a neat trick. File the grove on the back of the bow enough to hold the string and string the bow. Then take and mark down beside the string on each side, and you have the natural lines for the groves
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I do it a couple of ways....But everytime, I start by laying out the groove on one side with a carpenter's triangle to get an actual angle to follow and mark it on the side. A coping say then to start the groove on the line marked. Then I use a rattail rasp to cut the nock to depth. You can do this on both sides to get the exact angle if you wish.
Another trick is to do the above on one side only then....turn the bow over and lay the rattail or a spare pencil in the nock groove from the underside. Take another pencil and mark on the centerline you see when looking down on the limb. Either way, you still need to fine tune the grooves to match(depth-angle-and width and flair if you flair the bottom side of the grooves.
Practice on wood slats is a great way to NOT screw up a bow....Good Luck!
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I was gonna do some pics of this the other day and figure...nah! Wished I would have now.
The easiest way I have found : File your first groove,at what ever angle you choose,(as all bows are different), then go to the other side,lay you file in the groove you just did and see the angle.mark that angle with a pencil,and start your file. File a bit and check your progress by simply alternating your file from the groove you are filing to the one you just did.
Or just leave a file in the first groove and use as a pattern. Very easy to file your second groove when you have a pattern to follow.
Give it a try ;)
Ditto. This works for me also.
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Make some sample bow tips and practice making nocks...not of your favorite bow when it is almost done. This will take some of the pressure off of you until you figure out which way works best for you.
Lots of good info here so give them all a try, on a practice piece, and figure which works best for you.
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Wow, You guys are awesome. Got plenty of ideas from all of you and I think my problem has been not using another tool to start the nocks. I've drawn lines but when using the round file I still screw em up. I think using another tool to scribe them it might be what I need, combined with leaving something in the first groove to make sure I'm on track. Appreciate it guys. And Jawge, I screw them up on self bows too....usually I fix them by turning them into pin nocks on those ;) And I can empathize with you about filing em backwards, the best set of nocks I ever filed, and I even got excited about, I had filed them at the oppositte angle. OOPS, they got turned into pin nocks..
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I draw a line across the tip where I want the string to be, then draw a 45 deg line down the side towards the belly, I draw across the belly to the other side, then draw back up to the other side of the line across the back. I always had a problem with starting the cuts, the file slips ect. so now I use a demolition jig saw blade that I wrapped the end on with duct tape, it has good bite and after cutting in the file rides in the groove nicely.
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Easiest way to have perfect looking nocks...cut half the amount. Side nocks lol
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I can't add much to the advice you already are getting except when I start the grooves, I cut them with a very small, fine half round rasp. When I get them how I want I clean them up with a chainsaw file.
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I draw a line across the tip where I want the string to be, then draw a 45 deg line down the side towards the belly, I draw across the belly to the other side, then draw back up to the other side of the line across the back. I always had a problem with starting the cuts, the file slips ect. so now I use a demolition jig saw blade that I wrapped the end on with duct tape, it has good bite and after cutting in the file rides in the groove nicely.
This is what I do also except I use the corner on a square file to start the cuts.
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Venisonburger has it down pat. If you follow his diagram it's hard to mess up. A 5/32" chainsaw file dragged slowly backward while using your thumb as a guide will give you a line to sight down. If you make a straight shallow groove across the back, slightly rounding to the diagonal on the limb sides, you can sight from the belly and make sure that they line up. By removing small amounts with the file from side to side, you can make minor corrections, and come out even. Takes practice, but the small diameter file will cut any wood, and give a nice finish that fits the string perfectly.