Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => HowTo's and Build-a-longs => Topic started by: gstoneberg on February 25, 2010, 11:48:34 pm
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I'm relocating my character osage bow build from the Bows forum over here.
Here's the stave I started with, the tree was felled in Feb 2009, the stave was split out in Jun 2009.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/character_stave_sm.jpg)
Here's day 1:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-1.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-2.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-3.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-4.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-6.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-7.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-8.jpg)
Tough stave, lots of weather checking and insect damage.
George
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Day 2
I didn't have too much time to work, primarily tried to remove the weather damaged wood in the bent section:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-9.jpg)
Normally I would finish laying out the bow and use the band saw to cut the excess width away so I don't have so much sapwood to remove. However in this case I'm not that confident the damage to the stave isn't fatal. So, I'll start work on the bows belly and make sure there'll be enough wood left for a bow before I put in the effort to follow one of those skinny growth rings.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-10.jpg)
The darker wood was so hard I used a sawsall to remove it. It was honestly like cutting bone. You can see there are some serious cracks to contend with.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-11.jpg)
George
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Good luck on this one, I started workin one almost identical to that. It was standing dead, and hard as a rock. I made a scraper from a thin bandsaw blade to work the rings on the curve. the rings in osage around here are thin anyway but they were like paper on that one. Scraping it sounded like fingernails on a chalkboard. it made its way to my "someday" pile you got me thinking about working on it some more.
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Day 3
Finished cleaning up the bend and used the draw knife to take out most of the weather checking. Ran into some insect damage in the sapwood. Hope it doesn't affect the heartwood much:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-12.jpg)
There are still some cracks under the bend that are troubling. Hopefully these will be removed as I thin the limb at that point.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-14.jpg)
Next will come the bow's back.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-13.jpg)
Good luck on yours jturner. There jury is still out on this one for sure. I'm amazed at just how hard that old dead wood is.
George
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Day 4
I started on the bow's back tonight. The ring I chose for the back ended up not being deep enough to get rid of the wood borer damage:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-15.jpg)
The next one worked out, and though I ran the draw knife until my arms about fell off, I didn't get much done:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-18.jpg)
I'm out of shape for sure. As an aside, a friend of mine is doing some work on a car in my shop and he brought over one these harbor freight halogen lights:
(http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/photos/66400-66499/66439.gif)
I have never used a light so effective indoors for illuminating the bow back while chasing a growth ring. It was nearly as good as being outside in the sun. I was surprised. It also kept the area warm, nice for this time of year.
George
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I've got to watch this!
I've never made a bow, thinking about it.
I'll bet there'll be tons for newbies like me to learn on following this.
Already tons of questions, But betting you'll be answering most if I just watch and learn.
Thanks to all you bowyers for taking time and posting these build alongs.
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I finished the bow's back today. There are 3 challenges in this stave. First, the character bend itself is troubling because of how hard the wood is. It will be right in the main bending part of the limb and I'm worried it'll fail there. Second, there is a crack coming out of that bend which was completely through the stave back to belly. I have it removed from the bend section but it goes right down the center of the limb. Third, there are 2 wood borer damage spots in the straight end of the stave that are going to be in the bow's back. Here are current pictures.
The weather damage:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-26.jpg)
Borer damage:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-27.jpg)
A small knot:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-29.jpg)
I marked where the center of the stave (and the handle) is:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-28.jpg)
This is the stave's current look:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-30.jpg)
George
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This looks incredible already! - hope you'll succeed, this is the most demanding stave I remember seeing...
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This looks incredible already!
Agreed!! Hard to believe it came from the limb in the original pic's.
Best of luck with the rest of it, man.
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Thanks guys. If this stave makes a bow it'll be a miracle. I didn't get much done today. It seems I'm doing everything out of sequence in this bow because I'm so skeptical that it'll actually work. I layed out the bows' basic shape and cut the limbs down to 1 1/2" in width (except for the handle which is still wider so I can clamp it in the vise). I narrowed the tips a little, but will do much more later. Then I worked the crooked limb to see if I could start to get a bend. Here's what it looks like now:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-31.jpg)
It looks to me like all the darker wood will need to be removed. I got it to bend just a little against the floor and it popped a ring loose on the belly. There's just a little left through the bend but there's quite a bit at each end of the bend. I'm most concerned with the outboard end of the bend. I'm afraid I'll be close to a hinge by the time I get the dark wood out. I did leave the limb a little bit wider there. I'm going to use the sanding drum to remove wood in that spot because it splits out so bad with the draw knife. That limb is the most difficult to run the draw knife on I've seen. It wants to dig in no matter which direction I go. Sure makes it tricky. That weathering crack is annoying. i'm afraid I'll have to let that crack be in the fade out where there will be no bending. That means there's quite a long non-bending fade-out off the handle in that limb. I'll also have to leave the handle a little wider than normal to keep the crack from running out the edge of the handle. This bow will probably get a wrapped cord handle to add some strength. O well, the wood dictates...
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-32.jpg)
George
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I worked for awhile tonight but the bow looks barely different. The limbs are thinner and the crooked limb is beginning to bend. The other limb is still a club, though I thinned it a lot. This is the slow part of the process, but my favorite part. Still, there are problems. After each time I floor tiller the crooked limb a ring on the fade-out pops loose. Unless the light is just right you don't notice. I'm not sure whether it's a fatal problem or not yet.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-36.jpg)
Definitely going to be some heat bending on this one.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-34.jpg)
Gonna start to reduce the tips here pretty quick.
George
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wow,,, that is going to be super cool!!....snake
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There's character, and there's character :o . You sure are one crazy guy to take on such a distorted piece of wood. It will of course be amazing if you can pull it off though, and so good luck!
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I've been a little hesitant to go much further because it meant I had to make the crooked part bend. Well, since it snowed here in Texas today and the ladies decided to watch a Lifetime movie marathon...I was motivated to go out to the shop. I'm to the point of cutting nocks and putting a long string on the bow for tillering. I hadn't used the tillering setup since we moved and I cannot find my stuff so I'm putting off more work until I can go get a pully and do it right. I did take a couple pictures, though there isn't much change at this stage. I brought the bow in to show my wife and took the pictures in here. She declared my odds for success at close to zero. Don't you love positive support like that? I'm even more motivated now...maybe that's why she said it??
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-38.jpg)
This bow has an odd feature on that bent limb, there's actually fade-outs going both directions in that crook. The wood rings seemed to stack up there but so far I'm nervous about removing the excess under that knot. As I thin that portion to get it bending it cuts the growth rings in the transition out into the limb. It's odd, and visible in these shots.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-39.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-40.jpg)
I think the fade-out in thin growth ring bows is has a unique beauty, I couldn't help but take a picture. Looks like I have to get those last 2 rings back in the center of the limb.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-41.jpg)
Hopefully, the next pictures will show tillering. Both limbs are bending on the floor, but it's impossible to get a feel for how even the crook bending is on the floor. Not sure I'll see it from the side either, but I'm hoping.
George
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have faith. i do in ya i wana see a pic at full draw gana be saweet.
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Stick with it....this will be a beauty
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Good luck! - this is a really interesting thread
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I'm sorry it's been so long since I've updated. My wife asked for a pergola for her birthday so I've had a different kind of woodworking project keeping me busy...and tired. I'm secretly hoping it rains this afternoon so I can get back in the shop. I know it's off-topic, but here's what I've done for her so far in the last few days. George
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/pergola-6.jpg)
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:o
That ain't a pergola... it's a small to medium comercial building site!!!
Nice job, George! Your wife should be very happy with that and you should be damn proud!!
(and yes... bring on the rain... ;))
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No rain, but the pergola is done. Hopefully I can get back in the shop now.
George
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/pergola-12.jpg)
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Well, I put the bow on my tillering setup and 2 things were instantly apparent. One, is that I'm waay too heavy yet; and two, trying to pull the bow imposes a significant sideways torque on the handle. I've always used a loop of rope to hold the bow under a bow scale and that does not work with this one. I'm going to have to create a different attachment approach (which I should do anyway). I'm happy that the bow is still so heavy, I'll be able to take quite a bit off the limbs and make the bent part flow into the rest of the limb without a width change. I had the camera with me, but I didn't get enough bending to show any tiller yet so I didn't shoot new pictures.
George
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Well, this bow intimidated me so bad I ignored it for a couple months. Tonight I finally sucked it up and began to work again. First I had to make a U-shaped clip to hold the bow on my bow scale for tillering without letting it twist. Then, I started taking off wood. The straight limb is normal tillering, the crooked limb is something totally different. It was doing all its bending in the crook, so I treated that like a hinge and haven't touched it. I took it very slow and at the end of the night I think it is bending enough to cut string nocks and make a string for it. I don't have the string running through the handle so I fired up the heat gun and bent the straight limb a little. In the morning I'll bend the other limb. I still have a long way to go, it pulls 45 lbs at roughly brace height. I didn't realize when I took the pictures that I wasn't pulling from the center of the bow. For the purpose of getting a string on the bow I don't think it matters. I think both limbs are too stiff in the tip, the crooked limb more than the straight limb. There's a knot just outbound of the crook that's making it tricky.
George
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-42.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-43.jpg)
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wow great job so far, the tiller is coming a long nicely
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Well, the bow broke today. I was afraid it might when I started and it did not disappoint. I had it tillered to about 26" so it was close. I was pulling it trying to see how it was bending through the crook when it went "bang". Interestingly, neither limb appeared to fail, it just got easier to draw. I felt the failure in the lower limb but didn't find a thing wrong down there. However, when I looked at the crook I discovered it had cracked clear through the bow, back to belly. The crack is about 6" long and nearly centered in the limb. It looks a little like a weather check when the bow is unstrung, but opens up when the bow is strung.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-44.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-45.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-46.jpg)
I did take one picture of it strung, but I didn't get any pictures drawing it.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-47.jpg)
I could glue the crack back shut and sinew back it, but my suspicion is that it wouldn't be that good a shooter and could still blow up in that crook. I'll probably order a set of sleeves, cut the bow just north of the handle and build another limb to match the still good lower limb. I have a sister stave to this one that is in the first picture of this build, it would be a good match.
George
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maybe just wrap it and glue it then make it a bow with short draw?
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Damn... shame it went and did that... Was enjoying the build along :(
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Too sad! I really was pulling for that bow to survive. It has the most severe curves I've seen.
D
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It is too bad, it was an interesting bow. I did learn that you cannot align the string through the handle without the bow strung on a bow this crooked. I put the bow stringer on one limb, pulled the string through the other limb tip and saw that the string was 2" outside the handle. So, I got out the heat gun and bent the straight limb till it lined up. Then I strung the bow and the string moved an inch sideways...I'd bent it too far. Had the bow survived I would have had to take half the bend out of that limb tip. Oops.
I'll mourn the death of the bow for a bit, then work another limb up for it and either splice them together or build a take-down. I've nver built a bow with recurved tips and might try that.
Thanks for the kind words,
George
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This was a very interesting buildalong - Sorry it blew up on ya :( good luck with the next one.
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I ordered a takedown sleeve from 3Rivers and have had it for a bit. With hunting season approaching I got back in the very hot shop today and began the process of turning my blown up crooked bow into a takedown. I started with the sister stave to the one I used for the crooked bow and sawed it down to just the straight section:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-48.jpg)
Then took it down to a growth ring, lots of insect damage. I'm beginning to think it'll be a short sinew-backed recurve.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-49.jpg)
Finally had to take the sawsall to the crooked bow...first time I've ever done that. Kinda painful. You sure can tell they're sister staves. Gonna have to take some of that bend out I put into it. Feel good about it so far, sure was hot though. Summer in Texas makes it tough to get in the shop. Interesting how much the wood has darkened on the bow.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-50.jpg)
George
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Couple more pictures from tonight. Worked on removing wood on the new limb
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-51.jpg)
and then got sidetracked fitting the brass sleeve insert on the limb from the crooked bow.
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-54.jpg)
I thought I could mate the limb up to that brass in about 15 minutes....boy was I wrong. It is ready to glue in now but I won't do that until the other limb is ready to go too. There is some water damage on that one and I asked a question about that over in the bow forum. http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,21094.0.html (http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,21094.0.html)
George
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Lookin good george.Cant wait to see how this one turns out.I love take downs,once i get a few more under my belt i will attempt one.
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Hey George, really glad you're saving what you can from the blow-up... looking forward to how this turns out :)
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Finally finished up the other bow so I could get back on this one. Since I had stolen the limb I prepared for this bow to save the other one, I picked out a new billet:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-55.jpg)
then took it down to a growth ring (had to go through the first 6 heartwood rings to find a good one)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-56.jpg)
laid out the bow and fitted it to the takedown sleeve:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-57.jpg)
Ended the day trial fitting everything together. Looks like I need to bend at least one limb to get the string in the handle:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-58.jpg)
George
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Comin along good george!!Cant wait to see this one take shape!!
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I worked on it more last night Randy. I can't figure the sleeve out. I had to heat it with a torch to get it apart and then all that happened was the wood came out of both sleeves (hadn't glued them in yet). Still had to drive the two metal pieces apart with a hammer. But, once they're apart they appear to go together easily. Dangdest thing I've ever seen. The bow wood must be expanding the brass or maybe there's a ding in the sleeve partway down. I'll probably have to sand the outside of the brass a little. This can't be as hard as I'm making it, but I'll get it.
George
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:D sounds like me george!!What you need is some spray lube and a bigger hammer!!Hahaha could be the wood is a bit tight.maybe try jus fine sandin wood til sleeve slides on nice an smooth?I dunno,never messed with em but they are on my list of to do's.
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Randy, it's the 2 pieces of metal I can't get to slide apart. They go together pretty easy until the smaller sleeve is about half way in. It pushes further, though hard so I stopped. Trying to get it out I couldn't move the dang thing. I tried heating up the steel, but the brass heats up almost as fast and finally the wood came out of the sleeves on both sides. I hate to glue the wood in there if I need to heat it to get the metal apart. I'm going to sand the outside of the brass then lube it and see if I can get it to go together and apart. I don't want it loose, but I need to be able to take it apart or it defeats the purpose.
I hope to get some more time on it later this week if I don't go hunting. Right now I'm leaning towards the hunting. There's a big 11pt hanging by our field feeder in the early morning. He beds by camp so any time there are people there he doesn't come out. I'm thinking about leaving home about 1am on Friday and parking out by the road at the lease. Then I'll take just the electric golf cart over to the field where I intend to set up a makeshift ground blind at the edge of the woods. The shot will be about 25 yards and I'll have to hold still a long time. I think it's my only chance though. The 11's been bringing a smaller 9pt and wide 6pt with him I'd also be happy to shoot. They don't come in every day so it's a crap shoot.
George
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I finally mastered the sleeve and got it working as a takedown. I sure made that harder than it should have been. I put some masking tape around the end of where the sleeves were going to go so the epoxy wouldn't stain the wood and then glued the sleeves in (removed the tape right away so it wouldn't glue permanently in place):
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-59.jpg)
Then I heat bent the limbs so they are straight and aligned with the handle:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-60.jpg)
Then I got a wild hair to try making a bow with green osage and knew I had a pretty crooked limb I could split and get started on. Here's how I will glue it up:
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/s_curve_bow-3.jpg)
Should be fun. Hope to get the takedown to the point of getting a string on it tomorrow.
George
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ahhhhh george thats gonna be so cool!!!hurry please ;) hahahaha
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Hurry... ::); you know better. This post has been going on for months. I do wish I'd cut my splice joint a little wider on the curvy set of billets so I could cut the handle crooked to align with the tips. It's probably better to follow the grain anyway. I was disappointed with the pithy center of that branch. Also disappointed that such a straight piece could bend so quickly. 2 of the 3 sections I cut bent badly. And the third has a big limb hanging on one side so I'm only going to get a couple good staves from it. Once again I was reminded how much green osage likes to check. In the time it took to remove the bark from the end of each curvy piece, lay out the splice joint, cut it out on the band saw and glue the billets together I got about a 4" long split on one billet. Fortunately it's to the side where it'll be removed. Anyway, I'm going huntin for 3 days so they'll be no bow work. I really wish I had arrows that flew out of that takedown. If I did, it'd be going with and I'd be hunting it using the temporary electrical tape and styrofoam rest and no finish. But, my arrows all fly sideways out of it. I do have a set of 45# Fred Bear cedar arrows wth the old carbon steel glue-on razorheads that have never been shot. They're still in the box but I've been hoarding them for when they're valuable. Haha. Still hate to dirty them up. Also have a set of 6 fiberglass arrows, not sure I have the box anymore though. Anyway, need to make up some arrow for this bow. Can't drive to Academy and pick up a set of 45# spined cedars. Too bad.
George
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After a very long time, this bow is now finished. What I thought would be a pretty wild character bow ended up a pretty ordinary, straight, slightly recurved takedown osage longbow. It measures 60" NTN, 51lbs@28". I used the sleeve takedown method, purchased from 3riversarchery. Recurving the tips really improved the way the bow feels when I shoot it and it now shoots heavier spined shafts better for some reason. Hope to take it hunting next week. Here are the final pictures, forgive me for not getting my bow arm horizontal.
George
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-67.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-68.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-69.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-70.jpg)
(http://72.64.80.21/gks-pictures/crooked-71.jpg)
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Fantastic job, what a save !! :o ;D ;D
Great work!
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Great job! Glad to see ya shootin' er!