Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Flintknapping => Topic started by: Timo on May 29, 2009, 08:00:27 am
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Since several have posted a few pics already I figure we can go ahead and get this months started. Those who have posted can go ahead and repost their points here so we can keep them all together.
I'm looking forward to this one.(I guess) ;)
Another note: How bout we keep track of how many we can make, and how many we break? ;D Might be neat to see what kind of ration we can get?
Here is a good example of an original.
http://www.lithiccastinglab.com/gallery-pages/6bclovispoint.htm
Another note: post the material ,and tools used, please.
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My first fluted Clovis ever....
(http://www.fototime.com/0856024FE05D8A7/standard.jpg)
I'll try a big 'un now.
PD
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I luv that lil point Pete. Is that movac?
BTW how is the stone work coming along?
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Oops, sorry about that Tim. Didn't see your's ::). You started it, so we'll go with yours ;).
I finally made something that resembles a Clovis. Now I think I'm getting the knack - time for a better'un ;D. This is Georgetown flint, made with copper tools. I almost pressure flaked out my little flutes, will have to keep that in mind next time.
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Awesome point there Paul!...ain't that Georgetown stuff sweet? I wish I had more of it....(hint, hint). ;)
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Dang Paul, that looks nice! (for starters) ;) ;D
Bout time for a new pressure flaker insurance item ain't it? That one has seen better days. :-\
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Have tried many times to get a flute, but I think I would fill up several pages of the broken ones. ;D
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Nice points,
Cowboy- Does Georgetown need heat treating or can it be worked raw?
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both rick. i have some for the gathering you can work with, or do you already have a stash in your end of the world kit? ;D
nice points guys. my ratio this far is 3 to 1. 3 dead and 1 survive. all hunting size points. the one problem im having is not really finishing the point before i flute it . so the ones that do survive are uglyyyyyyyy!!
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Jamie, not haveing the point finished is not a bad thing ya know? At least it is less taxing on the ego to break one that hasn't got all your time envolved? I tried last night....this thing eludes me so far.
3 preforms made,(one of which I was very proud of) and 3 broke......sigh....... :'( I think my main problem is the angle and not being able to hit it just right. Pi$$es me off somethin fierce I tell ya..... >:(
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Yup, Patrick - that is some sweet stuff. I even tasted it once :D. I'm headed back to that guys ranch today, I think mainly to get away for an afternoon. Most of it works well raw Rick - some would do better with a little heat. This is my fifth attempt, first one broke, next three just would not flute, this one kinda worked. I'm about to figure out how to set it all up.
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one problem i find to is the tail end needs to be kept pretty thick for setting up the platform. i keep losing a lot of length when i set up my platform. and if i screw up i have to remove another half inch or so each time i set up the new ridges and platforms.
tim thats why they are ugly . as soon as i get a decent biface i go after the flute. then i have to clean it up. and two of them i lost a lot of the flute when i cleaned up the edge
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both rick. i have some for the gathering you can work with, or do you already have a stash in your end of the world kit? ;D
nice points guys. my ratio this far is 3 to 1. 3 dead and 1 survive. all hunting size points. the one problem im having is not really finishing the point before i flute it . so the ones that do survive are uglyyyyyyyy!!
No stone in the end of the world kit. Just Guns, ammo and coffee. ;D
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nice points. look really good. man I am envious.
tried to flute my first ever last night. No luck. didnt break but didnt flute either... just keep getting shorter and shorter. :-\
guess I need to study up more on how to setup that nipple. and the back ridge.
n2
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First pic is self exp. The wht burllington piece was a killer piece of rock,w/ red dna attached. Made me sick to break it. Tried to keep the tip strong before the fluteing but still failed. Bad angle I think.
The basalt point was almost finished before I tried to flute, went fair on one side and then the second side ....well I hit it too fat.
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Got this one done last night. Raw burlinton, antler percussion and copper flaker.
After I had my initial percussion done I straightend my edges,and then pressure flaked both side to set up a better ridge,and clean the areas so the flutes could travel. One went in and stepped into some concrete,the other didn't travel much at all,but I left it alone.
I think that one should try very hard to get a good ridge built into his percussion work,clean up and then flute. We'll try again later today.
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Looks good to me Timo! That basalt now - where do ya get ahold of some of that? I heard it's all over Hawai, but I ain't planning on driving over there anytime soon ;D.
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finally got one i like. ill post the garbage later. paul's georgetown. all antler. still have to finish the tail end up and put the edge on but it didnt break. yeah!!!!!!!!!!!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/coyotebow/knapping/001-2.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/coyotebow/knapping/002-1.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/coyotebow/knapping/003-1.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/coyotebow/knapping/004-2.jpg)
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thats a beauty tim. i cant manage to get more than broken debris when i work burlington. to delicate for me. i always manage to snap it as im finishing it up
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Nice job jamie! Looks good to me! ;)
I see a lil quartz pocket in there?
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Nice one Jamie! I hear ya on the garbage. I gave up on clovis's for the time being and am delving into thinning :).
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yeah i may try another later in the month but i want to start making stuff i can use rather than a debitage. im glad we did this though. its a great way to learn end thinning if you ever need to remove that big booger from a point that just wont go away. or if you want to ruin a nice point and make some scrapers. ;D
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wow, Jamie sweet point. I cant make one >:( good job everybody (taking notes)
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dude you should see how many i killed to get that one . best thing about this challenge is im sorta getting used to the fluting. used it today on a cahokia point to remove a big booger i couldnt pop off
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Nice points guys, That fluting is quite impressive.
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Well here's a couple attemts at the almighty clovis,the flute didn't travel well in these two.The coral one is raw,I don't think they started heating rock till later in history.I gave it a good whack and that's all I got out of it both sides are the same.The texas point was the same thing thought I had a good set up just a pityfull flute
(http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk33/Bonepile/clovis018.jpg)
This one came out better,strange that I can do better on the smaller ones you'd think the nipple would be harder to hit.
(http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk33/Bonepile/clovis022.jpg)
Well I have a bunch of knife blades that need handles so I'll be in Knife mode for awhile,maybe give this another try later,we have a whole month
Hapy fluting
Bone pile
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Those look good Bone, Not sure why flutes don't travel well on some. Ridge,energy lose, bad place in rock, angle of hit,hand speed,and amount of force involved with the hit,platform prep......Lots can go awire? ??? ;D
I'm gonna play some more with it also. I think building a ridge into the point with percussion,giving it good convexity prior to any pressure work is key,(along with everything I already mentioned) ;)
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Them look good Roger - bummer about the flutes. That third one came out good though. I got tired of breaking all my hard earned bifaces - think I'll pick back up on the clovis's later too.
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i wouldnt of had the stones to try and flute those. excellent work
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Well it ain't very good, but here is my first try at a Clovis. I got two flutes, but really they are just thinning flakes, not deep enough. I'll keep trying.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b186/ducosniffer/Clovis%20Challenge/Clovis11.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b186/ducosniffer/Clovis%20Challenge/Clovis12.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b186/ducosniffer/Clovis%20Challenge/Clovis13.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b186/ducosniffer/Clovis%20Challenge/Clovis14.jpg)
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Looks perty good Shane! Raw Nova right? ;D
You've come along ways grasshopper. ;)
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Worked on a good piece of raw Texas last night Nice two tone color (perd I think) and thought I'd finish it after work....Shoulda left well enough alone.
Was turning out well so figured I'd give it some flutes..
The first flute went very well,I was impressed.The second one....Not so well. I put the piece back together and you can see I had a thin spot where is snapped.
So I took the tip back to the shop and again,not kowing when to quite I fluted one side great,then the other...... ::) :'(
Somedays? :'(
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Well, here's my first feeble, effort. I new this piece of Rainbow was gonna be iffey on the fluting, but I had to whack it. I had it prepped too good. Right where the flute dove to the left was a bunch of ash bubbles. I was hoping I could blast through it. It dove so deep and made it soo thin I was afraid to smack the flat side, so I set up a small platform and pressure flaked that side. It's not a Classic, but it is sharp and will still mount on a shaft easy.
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wow ed thats a beautiful piece of rock. never seen rainbow before. tim ii have about ten of those on the floor of my truck :P
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That rock is pretty, Jamie. I was trying to catch the light to bring out the purple's and green's.
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Gawd Tim - some days your the bug huh? That's why I moved along to easier things for awhile, and that thing was looking mighty good! That is some purty stuff Eddie, and your point didn't break - yahoo ;D.
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The rainbow ob is some awful perty stuff. Good to see someone can build these things without breakin them. ;)
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Tim, I guess I didn't hit it hard enough. ::) ;D
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Timo I usally break 3 then call it quits for the day,that sucks but you didn't give up that's the main thing.Eddie that looks good,that rainbow stuff gives me fits.Well this challange went so well whats next,cumberlands >:D........NOT!!!!!!!!
Bone pile
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one question on the clovis. am i supposed to be getting the hinge at the end of the flake or not. sometimes i do but usually i just get a clean taper. also if i get the hinge i usually break it ;D
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Jamie, Most of the clovis That I have seen had a step, never carriying past the center of the point, although some were ever so slight. The western clovis were wider with a more distinct percussion scar pattern, and had a short flute,that usually went in and stepped. Just doit bro! ;D
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alright ill see if i can break a couple today ;D
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This month is more of a challenge than I bargained for. I broke one made of raw Pedernales while trying to flute the first side and the other broke at a hidden vuggy spot in the other piece of coastal plains I was working. Practice, practice...more like makin' driveway gravel...
Jim
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I had a very hard time with this one also. I messed up on 4 attemps, and used up a couple small obsidian nodules. On this last one, it broke in half on the second flute - just like one of the other attempts. So, I continued working the front half and made a short one. The flutes are a little wide and almost identical on both sides. So here is my shorty.
Allen
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Looks good Allen! I think this has been a learning expeience for us all and a very challenging challenge ;D.
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Here's one from Justinite obsidian, not great, but it didn't break (I've got several half-Clovises I'll make somebody a good deal on ;D ) Flute on other side is not quite as far, but fairly well matched. It's not paper-thin at the base, but I'm leaving well enough alone. :)
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That looks good, Steve. Looks like a Classic, Clovis.
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Steve, That's agreat looking clovis, Every time I try an get fancy an flute an obsidian I end up with two pieces. I think I,ve got lots of two pc heads just not obsidian.:>{ Later Bob
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Really a good looking point Steve.Great looking mat!
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I don't blame ya Steve, I'd leave well enough alone too. That's a fine looking flute and point.
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wow steve thats awesome
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That sure looks like a keeper clovis to me,don't know if I've ever heard of that kind of obs.looks good
Bone pile
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Very nice point Steve.
So what kind of challenge is July gonna bring?
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How about lets go simple, Hernando's or Arridondo's.
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I'll have to look them up eddie, I bought the 10th edition of Overstreets :)
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Mullet, can you post some pics of that point type?
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Sounds good to me. Somebody start it, or I can later.
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Sounds good to me it's so hot the lead in my bopper's gettin' runny
Bonepile
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June's Clovis is kicking my butt. I keep snapping points or blowing out flutes. No telling how many points I've screwed up. Maybe the next one will be it.
Jim
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ME too Jim.This challenge has me in appreciation for those who have figured it out with some consistencies. So many things play into making one of these darn things, Good clean ridge/convexity, perfect platform/nipple, correct billet swing, And I think one of the most important is angle. I still ain't got it down.... Got alot of takedown points for proof too.
This was a very good challenge,and one that I will continue to work on.
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(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a257/hardawaypoints/Knapped%20points/challengeclovis.jpg)
As lame as this one is, it will be my entry to the June challenge. No telling how many rocks I blew up trying to get one done. I had to hit the flute twice and chase the edge with a pressure flaker. The other flute only ran about 3/4ths of an inch. It would work on the end of a spear, but it is not the best example of this point type I've ever made.
Jim
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looks like a keeper to me,I seen this challange as a wake up call to alot of us as we make our favorite points to realize that one of the oldest points is by far not the easyist to make.Look forward to the new months challange and everyones entry's.I'm saving all my challange points to put in a case.
good looking point,I'm sure it will work
Bone pile
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That one looks fine to me Jim! I'm going to try them some more in time - got a few idears now that I'm hoping will help.
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I figure since I haven't posted one yet, I might as well show ya'll this one. I cheated on the flutes.(Ishi stick) ;D I know it's not "correct", but I thought the rock was too pretty to break.
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that one came out right Shannon! I'm thinking about your inner tube technique for my next one ::).
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Jim, that's a nice one, sure nothing wrong with that! And Shannon, you make me sick. I think you've been knapping for twenty years and are just pulling our legs about just starting. :) That one's a dead ringer for those Redstone/Clovis points that had the multiple narrow flutes and pointy tips-looks authentic. Purty piece of rock, too.
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Steve, I had the finest teacher in the world ;)
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Jim,I think that is a right nice piece! Love the material,looks like Reed springs?
Shannon, I second what hillbilly said.That is nice.
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Nice points guys! What material is the last Clovis made out of?
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Wildat86, that's Sonora flint. It's normally all blue. But sometimes out near the cortex, it's brown like that.