Bow fail diagnosis request

[HH~]

Ipe aint Hedge Apple. Ive made a bunch of boo Ipe, or boo and S American rosewood, boo hedge, boo hickory, boo Waiwi boo, etc , etc . Had my own 70ft tall boo thicket in a gulch at my Ranger Camp. So, i did LOTS of Bamboo work.

Eric is right adhesion was the issue but just ipe on belly can be picky. Just a little to much thickness on boo on ipe will blow it out every time.

HH~

[Mesophilic]

The boo is .190 to .200 measured across the cross section of the crown and a pair of calipers, and .140 at the edge. 

I didn't do the glue up on this stave so I can't answer any questions on the process.  Figured I'd help support a younger bowyer and have a project to work on during all this virus shutdown.   We'll see how he choses to handle the situation and maybe the info you guys are sharing will help him in the future.

[scp]

The bamboo backing appears to be thin enough. How thick is the ipe belly? If it is relatively too thin, it still could have been overpowered by the bamboo backing. If it is all about the glue, the bow can be saved, even if you might have to add a full-length belly overlay strip. Another rather thin bamboo strip on the belly would be a good experiment and exercise in gluing bamboo on ipe. Better sand and clean out the old epoxy real well. You can tiller it on the sides or even the bamboo overlay itself. Good luck, depending on how much you are willing to bother with it.

[PatM]

Why on Earth would you want to do enough repair work that could be spread over three new bows?

 If a belly strip like that is considered OK then Rudder bows was a quality bow source.

[scp]

Why on Earth would you want to do enough repair work that could be spread over three new bows?

 If a belly strip like that is considered OK then Rudder bows was a quality bow source.

I personally make mostly self-bows. I probably made less than a dozen bamboo backed bows. But it appears that my bamboo backed bows are performing better than self-bows. So I have been gathering up some exotic hardwood, just in case I want to experiment more. If backed bows are acceptable, why not a tri-lam, even though I don't remember making one intentionally. I at most did try such a repair once or twice over the last ten years. I'm considering a bamboo backed bamboo bow for this year.

[Tuomo]

EA40 is ok epoxy. You would be much better served with a epoxy that was designed for laminating wood lams.

What would be "better" epoxy? EA40 is very good bow gluing epoxy. I have been using it years and now glue failures. So, are there better bow epoxies?

[PatM]

Huntsman Epoxy.

[PatM]

Why on Earth would you want to do enough repair work that could be spread over three new bows?

 If a belly strip like that is considered OK then Rudder bows was a quality bow source.

I personally make mostly self-bows. I probably made less than a dozen bamboo backed bows. But it appears that my bamboo backed bows are performing better than self-bows. So I have been gathering up some exotic hardwood, just in case I want to experiment more. If backed bows are acceptable, why not a tri-lam, even though I don't remember making one intentionally. I at most did try such a repair once or twice over the last ten years. I'm considering a bamboo backed bamboo bow for this year.

 That has little bearing on it being a good idea to repair an awful mess and then turn that into a tri-lam.

 

[mullet]

I have to go with the bad glue job. And, it is Ipe. When I glue anything to Ipe I scrub it down real good with acetone and sometimes oven cleaner.

[scp]

That has little bearing on it being a good idea to repair an awful mess and then turn that into a tri-lam.

I don't sell or even give away my bows. All my suggestions are for learning and experiment. We learn more from our failures.

[Tuomo]

Huntsman Epoxy.

Hard numbers and facts would be nice, and some reasonings too. Comparing for example Araldite 2011 and EA40, pure strength values are quite similar. But EA40 has for example much higher glass transition temperature, which is very good feature.

This case, it was not the glue's fault but user's fault. I have made some gluing mistakes also and good gluing is not always so simple. There are many issue, which are affecting to the quality of gluing. Usually the instructions for use of the glue are valid.

[PatM]

That has little bearing on it being a good idea to repair an awful mess and then turn that into a tri-lam.

I don't sell or even give away my bows. All my suggestions are for learning and experiment. We learn more from our failures.

   This wasn't his failure.

[HH~]

Pat M hit it on the head.

HH~

[scp]

That has little bearing on it being a good idea to repair an awful mess and then turn that into a tri-lam.

I don't sell or even give away my bows. All my suggestions are for learning and experiment. We learn more from our failures.

   This wasn't his failure.

Was it the failure of the bow? If you are not interested in investigating the failure further, why do you bother to keep on reading the thread? Not sure what you are trying to achieve here.

I still wanna know how thick was the ipe belly.

[PatM]

The guy who glued it up is responsible.   My purpose is to stop people from trying to rectify mistakes made b.y others.

 And to stop noobs from rushing into business before they have even mastered the simple side of things.