advice on first time shaft buy

[mud duck]

 Once upon a time I'd have spotted the smoke from this campfire and politely approached to within shouting distance. Then I'd have hollered "Hello in camp!" and waited for somebody to reply. And then of course I'd have passed around the customary tobacco before asking any questions, "no offence intended..."

 Been away from archery for a long time. I have 2 old bows here, a 30# shoots off the hand, and a 35# shoots off a little shelf. Nothing special about 'em, but nothing wrong with 'em either; and from what I remember, it's all about the arrow anyway. I started off looking to just buy some arrows, but then I started thinking, maybe carbon arrows weren't designed to perform off the hand/shelf?
 So then I started thinking about a new bow (center or past center cut riser) and some carbon arrows. I remember when martin archery first came out with the hatfield takedown. I wanted that bow so bad back then I could taste it. After a quick amazon browse of hecho en china takedown recurves, I can't even stomach the thought. I'd sooner buy a crossbow.

 Nope, deep down I feel like, in spite of all the modern FPS & FPE advancements, we're loosing a very old, very important art. There's no stopping it. No fighting it. Momentum will surely drive the industry into ILF & ultramagnum bullpup crossbow futures. Billions & billions served, right? I fired my first, and most likely last, crossbow bolt last fall. 50 yard bullseye on the 1st try. Scope makes it accurate as a rifle. AWESOME. If I planned to hunt, that's what I'd get; but I digress... what a dreadful contraption...

 I fletched (jig) a few shafts as a kid, poplar I think? or maybe birch? Some flew pretty good. Aluminum was what I thought I wanted back then. Most of the really old arrows I remember were doug fir, but then cedar came along, and of course fiberglass, and by the time I was born easton aluminum was all the rage. But again, I digress...

 I want feathers & wood, baby! self nocks!! I've had this idea rolling around in my head now for about a year. I'm just an old man, and I won't leave much behind when I go, so I'm on a mission to hand down some damn fine backyard arrow heirlooms for the young folks to remember me by.

 Granted the learning curve is HUGE and I'll probably have to make like 100 before I get it right, so I'm looking at a bulk shaft buy. Obviously bare shaft tuning is first on the menu here. I've done my homework, but I'm still not quite sure where to begin?

 After reading the excellent bamboo build along here, I looked at some big box raw tonkin cane. The local stuff looks pretty iffy to me, so maybe carmelized tiger shafts? I found the sitka hunter shaft bundles online, and shopped ash/birch/poplar dowels. Whatever I settle on, I expect to sort through a bunch.

 Ok, so, now that I've poured my heart out to all you experts, steer me right and I'll do ya proud. Again, 30# & 35# recurves. It would be nice, ultimately, to reach out to 30 yard target (max range here), but I might settle for 20 or 25. And for sure, I want self nocks. I think?Right? so what shaft material would you start with, if you were me?

 Thank you kindly in advance,

  mud duck

[Pat B]

 Welcome to PA, mud duck.
Commercial Port Orford cedar(POC) or Sitka spruce would be good starting point. Your supplier can make recommendations as to diameter and spine with a little info from you. Self nocks are easy but time consuming. I make a single saw cut across the grain lines then open the throat with a thin knife and sand paper folded over and over again until it fits your string. Be sure to add a wrap below the nock. I like sinew but have used strong, thin thread like silk then set it in super glue, TBIII or other sealer.
 We have sponsors here on PA that are arrow and shaft venders and could help you with your choice.
Please keep us posted with your progress...and we love pics.   

[sleek]

Funny you say you want Feathers and Wood. We have an outstanding vendor here who happens to be named that very thing. Feathers and Wood. Give them a holler, they WILL fix you up right.

[Deerhunter21]

wait sleek, whos the vendot? are you talking about TSA or three rivers?

[Pat B]

Deerhunter, check out our sponsor's list.

[mud duck]

 I'm really torn between cedar/sitka/larch/doug? I know cedar was king forever, but I hear tell new growth isn't what it used to be? What's left of the old growth (wild) is highly threatened now (root disease) and the cultivars seem to vary quite a bit https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chamaecyparis_lawsoniana

 my gut says try sitka larch or doug, first, but I'm not sure which one? opinions?


 

[Pat B]

Sitks spruce makes a very good arrow.
 Most, if not all POC shafts are made from dead trees.

[Lefty38-55]

For those bow weights I'd say 5/16" POC shafts is the way to go, plus I've seen some of the other shaft woods made in smaller than 11/32" diameter and spines below 40-pounds.

I will tell you I just bought a dozen 5/16" POC shafts from The Footed Shaft and they are THE best quality shafts I've ever seen. Each was weighed and spined individually and marked accordingly. For the dozen, all 12 were within a 3-pound range for spine and 10-grains total span for arrow weight. Superb!

[Buck67]

For just getting back in the game, you could go to your local Lowes or other big box and pick over their 5/16" Poplar  dowel rods.  Out of a hundred I may find 6 or 7 that have grain that runs from one end to the other.  Most 5/16" Poplar dowels will spine at about 35#.  For feathers and points I have a lot of good luck with 3 Rivers in Fort Wayne, IN.  I really like their Fletching Tape, it's a 1/16" wide two sided sticky tape that really makes fletching without a jig possible.  No holding a feather in place until the glue dries.  My practice arrows of Poplar dowels have been shot hundreds of times with very few breakages.

I have played with buying bamboo tomato stakes from a landscaper.  I bought 300 once in a big bundle.  I'll bet I only managed to find 30 that were worth making into arrows.  The big problem with bamboo is that two shafts of exactly the same size can spine between 35 and 95 pounds. Good thing my wife is a gardener.

Welcome back to the Council Fire

[mud duck]

 Thanks everybody for the tips. I can't seem to make up my mind between poc and sitka. Naturally I really want poc, but I have a feeling I should try sitka too, so I've decided to get a little of each and see what works best for me.

 I've never cut a self nock before so it makes good sense to experiment with that on poplar first. I'll grab a 5/16 next time I go to town. Actually I'm starting to second guess myself about the nocks. I started out thinking with such light DW, self nocks would last forever. Now I'm wondering if that's a mistake. It would be easy to replace a plastic overnock someday, but a busted self nock might not be fixable at all? I was kinda thinking bamboo when I said selfnocks, and now I'm not so sure about cedar/sitka selfnocks?

 anybody here use the bohning feather tower?

[Buck67]

To cut a self nock, use a carbide tile saw.  The round blade is about the right size.  All self nocks should be reinforced with cotton thread or sinew wrapped around it.  I like to wrap a distance about 1" below the nock.  You can use Elmer's glue to seal the wrap.

I have repaired broken nocks.  Simply square up the broken part with a saw, cut a new piece to replace it and glue it and wrap it.  After the glue has dried, cut the nock.

[mud duck]

 I saw a few copper reinforced selfnocks online awhile back. Might have been bamboo?

 Now I'm onto the AMO wood arrow standards https://archeryparent.files.wordpress.com/2015/03/amo-equipment-standards.pdf

 Do I have the right link or is there a different/better/more up to date resource available?

 I'm already having a lot of fun just researching this stuff. I think maybe it's in my blood? My grandad made doug fir arrows, and I sure am kicking myself now for not hanging onto any years ago. One of my favorite catchphrases is "it's not rocket science." Replace a water heater? it's not rocket science. Leaky roof? it's not rocket science. But I just realized wood arrows definitely IS the original rocket science 

[Hawkdancer]

Check out Sitka spruce, and  hemlock from TSA, one of the sponsors.  POC is good, chokecherry, red osier dogwood, lots of good arrow wood, your choice!
Hawkdancer