ERC and MR almost replica Yew bows

[peacefullymadewarbows]

Well guys, as a bowyer you must learn not to fall too far in love with one bow... Who am I kidding that cedar is beautiful but, she blew after 20 shots the day after I took these photos  . She made about 130 plus shots just fine (even in colder drier weather) before getting oiled up. You live and learn. I am thankful to have more staves to try with will hopefully come out to a more durable result. Goal of at least 1000 arrows and most of them after I pretty her up I hope. I won't pretend ERC is the most durable wood BUT variation between staves is huge so hopefully, statistics will help me out eventually. This was a pretty garden variety stave. Just an update for all glad she made it as far as she did. Each attempt goes further than the last. 

[Mikkolaht]

Dang man...
Feels bad to hear that, but you can all ways make new ones 

[peacefullymadewarbows]

Well, look at the new post on the warbow page haha. 

[Badger]

Very nice work, I like the tiller on that yew bow, makes for a snappy shooter with no handshock. I never fall in love with ERC, I have made maybe 1/2 dozen and they all eventually broke.

[peacefullymadewarbows]

Were they self bows? Can you elucidate as to why a bow that once made it to full draw just fine eventually breaks? Is it that the wood can't take the vibration of the shot? It has me curious because my bow broke when only at 29" on the arrow when it had of course made and shot from full 31" so many times before.

[Del the cat]

Presumably bows break for similar reasons that valve springs or suspension springs in a car will break.
The constant cycle of stress  leads to the weakest point giving up eventually. Of course not all springs break, so presumable the weakest point in the ones that break is weaker than that of those that don't break.
The weak point may be anything that concentrates the stress, a pin knot, a buried knot, a nick in the fibres. It may only be relatively weak because of a stiff point either side of it. It could be something several rings down inside the bow that happened to the tree years ago... a passing wizard leaned his staff against tree or a squirrel gnawed the bark .. sorry getting silly now 
OK metal fatigue take somewhat longer but steel springs exhibit the same properties in other respects too. E.G they take a set.
Del
PS... it's a quiet day here ... too wind for the flight shooting I was hoping for 

[peacefullymadewarbows]

Interesting. Silly is always good. I bet that squirrel knew it was gonna be a bow in the future and wanted to play the long con on me  . Yeah it is true we can't see the flaws that may be too small or lie totally encased in the bow limb. Suppose that's the chance we all take with making these things. Thank you for your response. It helps me decide what'll truly make a good bow beyond just making it to full draw on the tiller. ... Just shoot slightly into the wind it'll curve back to a straight shot minus a few yards of course .

[meanewood]

Last week I had my first broken string (Linen) and was a bit of a shock, but on reflection, it was always going to happen soon.

That's the thing about working with natural materials and taking them to their limits.

It's a bit like life it's self. In medieval times life was hard and people were much more aware of their own mortality than we are nowadays.

Will mentioned the haphazard finish on the 'Mary Rose' bows. That could be a sign of how the bowyers viewed their work, a tool that was disposable and not something to spend needless time 'Tarting Up'!

The thing is, wood is the most amazing thing and when you add the life or death functionability of a hand crafted longbow, they are truly a thing of beauty and we can be forgiven for shedding the odd tear when one passes away.

I try to be as 'traditional' as possible when making these bows and strings but I know I'll never be satisfied with a bow until that pesky last tool mark is sanded out!

[Sidewinder]

Sorry to hear about the bow breaking. I commented on your other post before I read this one. It was really beautiful and thats the allure of ERC so I think backing it is the way to go.
 One thing I noticed with ERC when I have cut ERC brush etc... is when you break a branch it will break easliy on tension side but the compression side is fairly stubborn. At least on green stuff so that tells me all I needed to know.
That ERC backed bow that won BOM last month  was a stunner and looks like a real shooter but it was backed. I used to try and prove conventional wisdom wrong until it kept hitten me up side the head. Now I have decided to try and not make the same mistakes others have that have proven to be foundational but build on the established wisdom and build on it from there.  Just my thoughts on the subject. Keep on keeping on buddy. Like jawge says " If your not breakin your not makin"

[peacefullymadewarbows]

meanewood- You should write a book like right now. But for real I could not have said it better myself. Historically these things are just tools but wood is such a unique material among nature. It's so beautiful to carve into and then bend that you can't help but feel attached the creation. I think especially the dynamic nature is what makes them seem almost alive which is what is so addicting about them. I commend you for trying to solve the riddle of the durable linen string. I'd like to build and outfit one of my bows someday with one but I'm still just trying to master bending the wood. Good luck to you.

sidewinder- I just posted on your last response haha. And thank you it's what has me addicted to the species at the moment how beautiful it is to look at plus how fast the wood is. That is  interesting I heard it was from the tension side that it was stronger but either way you're supporting what I've read elsewhere that branch wood is far stronger than trunk wood. My dream stave would be a ring dense stave from a horizontal grown branch. But maybe the compression side is stronger because it lays down more lignin to hold the pushing force. I will note that when I next harvest thank you. Like I said before I do want to try a backed one once I have a stave straight enough to lumber. Probably with elm but maybe with thin hickory. And you might be right. I may be in my rebellious bowyer phase and will learn through six more snapped ERC self war bows that a long lasting one can't be made. The new one is at 77 shots right now so let's let the data roll in. The fun is in the breaking!... it's not but I like this challenge right now and I'll go until it floors me or until I've got one figured out I suppose. Thank you for your information and time.

[TimothyR]

Gorgeous bows.

[peacefullymadewarbows]

Thank you Timothy!

[bradsmith2010]

Nice bows.,,congrats....could you make the cedar longer in hopes it would last longer? Or do u think it would hurt performance?

[Badger]

    I am curious what the mass weight on those bows are. My mass calculator would call for the erc bow to be about 30 oz but I suspect that that might be too light.
   On the yew bow it calls for about 33 oz because of the elyptical tiller but I always deduct some when yew is used.

[peacefullymadewarbows]

Hey guys. I think I had that specific ERC measured out to 32oz. Steve, but that was a while ago before it broke so don't take it as gospel.

Hi brad. I actually have 2 more surviving ERC bows both 101lbs @ 31" that have survived 200 plus arrows that are actually shorter. One is 77 inches ntn and 29.1 oz and the other is 80 inches ntn and 30.8 oz. So I think you get lucky with some staves that will hold up and others are the stereotypically brittle in tension.