thoughts of burying osage in the dirt....???

[PEARL DRUMS]

Ever see an old buried fence post not full of checks and cracks you have to piss with? I haven't.

[ohma2]

All you will gain is wet wood today and same thing when you recover them.

[Pat B]

We all work hard to get our bow wood to the optimum M/C so we can make bows that achieve their full potential. I have no problem with experimentation, after all, that's how we all got here where we are in wood bow building. I can see trying this method on one or 2 staves(if you have plenty to work with) but you are asking folks that have hundreds of years of accumulative knowledge and not heeding their advise. Why not spend you time prepping your staves in a tried and true method so you can build the best bows of your ability.
We had a guy here a few years ago that heard soaking your staves in urine was the best method to use. It's obvious if you have read through our pages of info that that method hasn't been used, at least nobody has admitted it.

[Bayou Ben]

And not to mention that most of the guys on this forum don't have osage readily available to them.

The osage bow I'm finishing up right now is from a $100 stave that my wife bought me for Christmas 2 years ago.  I saved it until now because I wanted to make sure my skills were at a point where I wouldn't mess up this treasured piece.  The thought of just tossing staves in a pond or burying it to experiment seems wasteful. 

I really am considering driving to AL to help you process all of this osage, as I understand you don't have much time to devote to this.  Let me know if you are interested, and I'll try and convince my wife. 
-Ben
   

[JW_Halverson]

Hmm, kinda reminds me of mullet's patented magic buffalo whiz cure-all for perfecting inadequate staves.

[nsherve]

Pat B, I ask if anyone has tried it to see what they have found. Maybe I've missed it, but it seems that nobody has. If they haven't then how can they advise me that it's a bad idea? The way you come across with this response makes me feel that you think I'm an idiot... Yes, the vast majority of the folks in this forum have much more experience than I. That's why I ask questions, and I greatly appreciate the responses of information. Just telling me I should not, with no hands on knowledge, is opinion. While I greatly appreciate opinions also (whether I also get hands on experience info or not), I have found throughout my life that it's not the same thing.
If I had to pay money for this wood, I wouldn't try it out. All I had to spend was time and gas money.
Now, if I'm coming across as an ass, I apologize. Please carry on.

[EdwardS]

We don't have experience doing it ourselves because others have done this before us and told us it doesn't work.  It's a logical fallacy to think we have to repeat the experiment time and time again.  If I wasn't allergic to Osage I would be glad to come remove sapwood and seal staves.  I'm just in Escambia county.  If it were any other wood I'd be there already.

[bradsmith2010]

like i said, I had a friend that said an old timer made bows like that,, so it has been done,, I think if you took off the sap wood, it would work better, I am just spit balling,, but it would act as a sealent to resist bugs and checking I think,,
I think leavingn the bark and sapwood,, will slow the process to much to be practical,, but with out the sap wood,, it might keep the bugs and checking at bay,, i have never tried this,, so am just speculating,,but am making a bow from a fence post,, so know it will hold up to being in the ground ,,,the guy I knew was from east Texas so the stave may have been buried in sandy soil,, aslo in TExas it was common for the old farm houses to be on osage pier and beam,, cause it did not rot, and the termites wouldnt eat it,,i actually owned a house builit like that,,
put a moisture meter on it before and after,, so you know how its working,, or worth the effort

[Hawkdancer]

I think it isn't whether it works or not , but rather there is a simple, somewhat easier and quicker way to do it.  Of course, if you happen to have allergenic reaction to Osage, you will want a different method!  Also, it depends on where you live and your climatic conditions.  I don't think anyone one is attacking any one else's intelligence, either!  Me, if I buried something, I'd probably forget where the heck it was without a big sign that said "Dig here in one year" - then I'd wonder if the sign was for me or the dogs! . Try it and report the results!
Hawkdancer

[mullet]

nsherve, I think what Pat is getting at, in a nice way is this topic was beat in the ground a few years ago and there was even a magazine article about it. Bury your staves down here in Florida and they will look like Swiss cheese when you dig them up.

[Pat B]

No nsherve, I don't think you are an idiot. It's your wood, you apparently have plenty of it and as I said I'm not against experimentation. Like Mullet said this subject has been beat in the ground and we as Admins and Mods have dealt with it many, many times over the last 12 or more years that I've been here on PA. My point is why buck a proven method if your goal is producing quality bow wood. I've seen all too many times what Mother Nature does as far as curing bow wood and usually it ain't pretty.
 I have a fence post that was in the ground for over 60 years. I've had it for 4 or 5 years now but when I got it it was full of checks, has worm holes in it but I will say it is hard as a rock. Whether a bow can be made with it is still to be determined. Just finding usable wood for a bow will be a daunting task.
 There are folks here on PA that would love to have a piece of osage to build a bow with. Putting an unusable piece of osage in the ground or in the lake as an experiment makes more sense to me than using perfectly good osage for the experiments. Just seems more practical to me.
 So you do whatever you want but when you ask for advise expect to get it whether it's what you want to hear or not.

[nsherve]

Pat B, I am planning to put one with huge knots and too much twist, or one too short for me (too much for me, anyway) in this experiment of mine, if I do do it. So, not one that I think is great...
I think, as far as fence posts go, the checks and splits have a lot to do with there being a lot of the post being exposed to the weather all year long for extended periods of time. I also think they may have been put in that while green, which could also have something to do with it. Once again, I have never done this so I want to see how it is when completely buried. I guess I have missed conversations of this same idea... Also, as I've said, I do really appreciate  the thoughts folks have in response.

[DC]

I think Mullet and Brad may have touched on the important part. How wet is your ground? If you live in Arizona burying it in the dry(ish) sand might be the perfect method of slowing the drying to prevent checking. Around here the wood would just get wetter.

[bjrogg]

Nsherve, you'll have a hard time finding anyone more patient and willing to try help answer someone's questions than Pat. We see and ask the same questions over and over on this site. We don't think any of them are idiots. It's good to ask questions. It's how we learn. How we improve. How our equipment improves. Sometimes it gets hard to answer the same questions over and over again, but Pat B is one of the guys you can count on to help out answering questions. He is honest with his answers and sometimes that's not what the person asking the question really wants to hear. I'm I'm not just talking about your questions. I'm talking about lots of questions. It's better to tell a person that their tiller isn't right and where to remove wood to make it right than to just say nice bow. We are all very passionate about our hobby. Sometimes it hurts our pride when one of our flaws are pointed out. There are very few people on this site that are trying to hurt someone's feelings. I honestly can't think of any.
I do understand your wanting to experiment. I do think your idea of burying a poor stave is a good one to cure you curiosity. My curiosity has got me asking a question though. I'm just wondering if you tried preparing any of those staves using the method so many have advised. As far as I know it's the safest most dependable method to use. I would very much encourage you to give it a try. I would very much encourage you to put up as many of the best staves you can using those methods. We're all busy. People sometimes tell me "I wish I had time to do that". I'm a very busy man. I don't have time to do this. I make time to do this. Often early in the morning. On my noon hour. Late at night. It helps keep me sane. I find it relaxing and honestly addictive. I'm not trying to make you feel bad. Honestly I think in a year you'll be thinking this was really good advice. Good Luck, sure wish I had a couple of those logs.
Bjrogg

[Pat B]

  ...for general knowledge and not directed to anyone specifically...
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