how much faster is a recurve than a strait tip bow?

[Badger]

  George, the Mojam results would not hold up to today's bows and arrows. The fastest one would only be considered average by todays standards.

   Jim Davis, I used a shooting machine to test hundreds of bows. The fastes bow I tested was a recurve by Mark St Louis at about 190 fps average for 6 shots. fastest D/r Bow I tested was one of my own at 188. Fastest straight bow I have tested is about 175. These were all wood or bamboo backed bows.

  Recurves consistently average higher than anything else. One of the reasons they have not done as well in recent flight shooting I think is that not many of them have competed. The recurves I have made for flight shooting were extremely fast but I never got any good distance out of them because of poor arrow flight. Not the fault of the bow. I have always done best with very conservative designs primarily because I get beter arrow flight out of them for reasons I have yet to figure out.

[Marc St Louis]

My experiences are in line with what Steve said.  My best straight limb bows have shot in the mid 170's and my best recurves in the mid to high 180's.  That means that Pat's claims are essentially right, 10 ~ 15 fps faster.  I certainly would be interested to know if someone has gotten better than 180 fps with a straight limb bow, this of course being tested with 10 GPP arrows and a true 28" draw.

[sleek]

Not everything takes precision experimenting, sometimes consistant results in comparision through experience is good enough.

Aaannnddd it would seem precise experiments done by experts disagree with me. I still hold my ground.  Thing of it is, even though I cant prove it, i belisve I have hit 188 with a straight bow.

[George Tsoukalas]

Steve, so what are you saying the recurves are better now-a-days?
Then, why would the straight limbers not get better too?
Seems to me I remember a certain straight limbed bow hitting 180 fps back then.
Check it out in TBB4.
It's too late for me to do so and you're younger than I am  and 3 hours behind.
Jawge

[PatM]

That bow was drawn to 30 I believe.

[George Tsoukalas]

No, 28" for all in the Mojam study.
Darn if that bow don't beat all. It was pecan too. TBB 4.

Jawge

[gfugal]

Do we have any flight speeds for horn bows? Or was it specifically reserved for self or wood only bows? The reason i bring it up is because of the ancient turkish flight contests. Surley they know what they were doing too and i have a hard time imagining them shooting anything other than an asiatic style horn bow, which have siyahs which are like recurves. Granted they probably didn't stick to 10 gpp or 50 lbs at 28". But getting the supposed 1/2 mile distance is no small feat no mater the rules.

[Badger]

Steve, so what are you saying the recurves are better now-a-days?
Then, why would the straight limbers not get better too?
Seems to me I remember a certain straight limbed bow hitting 180 fps back then.
Check it out in TBB4.
It's too late for me to do so and you're younger than I am  and 3 hours behind.
Jawge

  George, I believe I was the one that tested the pecan bow of Bakers you are referring to , It was drawn about 31" and pulling around 58# I believe with a 500 grain arrow so it would not have been a valid test for 28" 10 grains per pound.

[Badger]

Do we have any flight speeds for horn bows? Or was it specifically reserved for self or wood only bows? The reason i bring it up is because of the ancient turkish flight contests. Surley they know what they were doing too and i have a hard time imagining them shooting anything other than an asiatic style horn bow, which have siyahs which are like recurves. Granted they probably didn't stick to 10 gpp or 50 lbs at 28". But getting the supposed 1/2 mile distance is no small feat no mater the rules.

  The bow that set that record was reported to be about 150# draw weight. Most of Adams Karpowitz bows test out a tad better than most well made all wood recurves. The few I have personally tested were on a par with very well made wood self bows.

[willie]

Brad
Thanks for keeping the recurve questions alive. There have been a few related threads lately, and this observation of Steve's helps  answer a few things, for me anyway.

  I can't tell you how many times I have built bows and decided to recurve them instead of thinning down the tips only to have them take additional set and wind up with the tips in the same place they were before I recurved.

must be a little extra wood storing some additional energy with the design difference.

[PatM]

Do we have any flight speeds for horn bows? Or was it specifically reserved for self or wood only bows? The reason i bring it up is because of the ancient turkish flight contests. Surley they know what they were doing too and i have a hard time imagining them shooting anything other than an asiatic style horn bow, which have siyahs which are like recurves. Granted they probably didn't stick to 10 gpp or 50 lbs at 28". But getting the supposed 1/2 mile distance is no small feat no mater the rules.

Adam Karpowicz has speed numbers  if you do a search.

[Marc St Louis]

Yes I do believe you were the one testing that bow Steve.

Here is a link to Adam's Turkish bow tests httpwww.atarn.org/islamic/akarpowicz/turkish_bow_tests.htm

[BowEd]

I've peeked at that.He needs someone strong enough to shoot his heavier bows.Quite impressive numbers though.

[George Tsoukalas]

Baker's pecan  bow was 71# at 28" and shot 184 fps. 

The poundage was more than I figured but still pretty good.

His 50 # at 28" pecan shot 164 fps. TBB4 P 110.

Mattingly's, Lord rest him, osage recurve shot 57# at 28" shot 173 fps.

Jawge

[Badger]

 George, keep in mind those tests were done with 500 grain arrows, nothing like 10 grains per pound. I don't have tb4 here with me but I thought his Pecan bow that won the contest was 47# and shot at 164.