Author Topic: Oak Selfbow Failure #1  (Read 10840 times)

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Offline crooketarrow

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2016, 11:21:53 am »
  That might be right the first year or so your building bows.

More like if your breaking bows your doing something wrong.

  I hav'nt broke a bow in 18 years and it was a 110# Osage.

  Get a stave.

   Staves have so much more of a advange than a board.
DEAD IS DEAD NO MATTER HOW FAST YOUR ARROW GETS THERE
20 YEARS OF DOING 20 YEARS OF LEARNING 20 YEARS OF TEACHING

Offline bubby

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2016, 11:25:32 am »
A 3/4" thick board doesn't need built up not to bend, you can just ad some cork to fill your hand if it needs it. Wood preference get an osage stave, why mess with the rest start with the best😉
failure is an option, everyone fails, it's how you handle it that matters.
The few the proud the 27🏹

Offline paulsemp

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2016, 11:29:14 am »
  That might be right the first year or so your building bows.

More like if your breaking bows your doing something wrong.

  I hav'nt broke a bow in 18 years and it was a 110# Osage.

  Get a stave.

   Staves have so much more of a advange than a board.


You must just be the best or your just a one upper... I know I'm not alone when I say I break one here and there.

Offline PEARL DRUMS

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #18 on: April 20, 2016, 11:43:31 am »
I haven't broke one in 19 years. And the last one that did break was #111.
Only when the last tree has died and the last river has been poisoned and the last fish has been caught will we realize we cannot eat money.

Offline ajooter

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #19 on: April 20, 2016, 11:52:28 am »
  That might be right the first year or so your building bows.

More like if your breaking bows your doing something wrong.

  I hav'nt broke a bow in 18 years and it was a 110# Osage.

  Get a stave.

   Staves have so much more of a advange than a board.


You must just be the best or your just a one upper... I know I'm not alone when I say I break one here and there.

+1

Offline Lumberman

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2016, 02:48:05 pm »
It has been 4 days, 4 hours and 45 or so min since I broke my last bow, making me 2 for 7 so far lol, not having to wait on staves to dry is at least saving me a lot of time and boards are quite accessible for me. Plus with each one a different concept becomes a reality, the handles look a bit better , the nocks become a little more refined.. If what they are saying is true by the time you or I get to a stave it'll be a breeze. crooketarrow I appreciate your passionate contributions on pa, tell it how you see it
« Last Edit: April 20, 2016, 02:51:54 pm by Lumber man »

Offline George Tsoukalas

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2016, 03:00:39 pm »
I broke 14 log staves from '89-'92.
Then I ran off 6 or so black locust and white oak bows, all from logs.
When I ran out of staves, I started using red oak boards.
I am not one to brag but ...I will. I found board bows too easy. No challenge.
But I was careful to use straight grained stock.
Jawge
Set Happens!
If you ain't breakin' you ain't makin!

Offline joachimM

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2016, 04:04:05 pm »
Osage is about the most forgiving wood, but why bother spending money on such expensive staves when you can find about any other wood much easier and cheaper.

The advantage of board bows is that they save you a lot of cutting and chopping wood from logs into staves and so on. All you need is a table saw, circle saw or band saw, a rasp and a scraper and you can make a shootable bow in an afternoon. So what if the first five or so break, as long as you learn from them you'll make progress. Chasing a ring on an osage (or black locust) stave will teach you much less and take as much time as building five bows, while being boring as hell.
Say you make 5 cm (2") wide inner limbs of 14 mm thick (a bit less than 5/8"), the handle only needs to be 19 mm thick (3/4") to just have a bendy handle 1" wide. There's plenty of boards you can use for those bows. On a 66" pyramid board stave this will give you the required draw weight, if not more.

Gluing a handle to a flat board surface isn't a big deal either. If you find a board that is already the right thickness (some 12-14 mm thick, 1/2"), cut it into a pyramid shape and just glue a handle to it, and it might not even require tillering, like this one here: http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,56290.msg769585.html#msg769585

From the pics you posted, it seemed the outer and mid limbs on the long string weren't bending enough, and the inner limbs a bit too much. That may have contributed to the break. Also, it seemed the limbs were still rather thick (how thick were they?), putting a lot of strain on the back.

So while you're looking for decent white wood staves, try some more straight grained boards and learn from them.

Joachim
 

Offline Clovis6

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2016, 04:35:15 pm »
Went back and measured the thickness at various places on the limbs:

Top:  3/4" at the riser fade, 7/16" at midpoint of the limb, and 3/8" at 3" below the nock

Bottom:  11/16" at the fade, 7/16" at midpoint, and 3/8" at 3" below the nock. 

It was 1/2" thick at the point on the limb where it broke (a little closer to the riser than midpoint of the limb)





Offline loon

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2016, 06:02:27 pm »
Could get hickory if you want forgiveness, but you'd probably learn more from a less forgiving wood like oak, no?.. I didn't know about the importance of side grain.

Offline bubby

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #25 on: April 20, 2016, 06:03:59 pm »
failure is an option, everyone fails, it's how you handle it that matters.
The few the proud the 27🏹

Offline ajooter

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #26 on: April 20, 2016, 06:22:20 pm »

Chasing a ring on an osage (or black locust) stave will teach you much less and take as much time as building five bows, while being boring as hell.
[/quote]

I would have to disgree...chasing a ring teaches you valuable lessons in using the tools of the trade.  It shouldn't take that long to chase a ring and I really don't find it boring...but that up for opinion.

The hardest part of building a bow is having patience to build one.  It is not a process to rush through.  I have nothing against using power tools but have found it is much easier to ruin a bow when trying expedite the process.  Take your time and enjoy the ride!  8)

Offline bjrogg

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #27 on: April 20, 2016, 06:36:52 pm »
It's is true if a bow breaks something caused it. I pertty sure everybody that's built them broke them I know I did. You have to figure out why and learn from it. I haven't tried board bow cut my own staves rush dried a few to start the learning process. I have a bunch curing now. Hang in there when you shoot your bow it's something money can't buy.😊
A hot cup of coffee and a beautiful sunrise

Offline bubby

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #28 on: April 20, 2016, 06:43:13 pm »
I agree with ajooter, now I'm not the fastest guy chaising a ring it gives plenty of knowledge to do it, but to each his own
failure is an option, everyone fails, it's how you handle it that matters.
The few the proud the 27🏹

Offline High-Desert

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Re: Oak Selfbow Failure #1
« Reply #29 on: April 20, 2016, 09:58:47 pm »
Boards are cheap, but you will spend a lot if time looking at grain, at the same time you will learn a lot about grain. When I first started, all I had to use was boards from the wood stores, I broke a lot of "bows," when I finally got a stave, I couldn't believe how much easier it was. I learned a lot about tillering and grain through all those boards. I have a had great luck with hickory boards, even with some violation. You'll make some nice bows from boards, once you learn from those boards, get a nice stave and make that dream bow. No matter what you do, you'll learn a lot, and from the look of that bow you started, you are on the right track. Good luck with your next one

Eric
Eric