First Osage long bow, how's the tiller?

[SLIMBOB]

Just for the record, it's not my trick. I learned it from someone else who passed it on to others like myself. At no charge and expecting nothing in return.  You will find that to be the rule among these guys.  Keep posting your progress and good luck with it.

[Scottski]

This is a great place to learn! Then you get to help others learn. Just a great site I think.

[SLIMBOB]

Reading my comments this morning I want to clarify something.  When you run the straight edge along the limb, be aware that the gap will be smaller along the handle, as it should bend less there.  It will open up as you move from the fade and then close up again as you near the tip (this is assuming a working handle and stiff tips.  That's what I am seeing here).  Once the gap begins to open after the fade it should remain fairly consistent as you move toward the tip.  If you have areas with little or no gap, then you have a flat spot that isn't bending enough and causing another area just beyond it to bend to much.  Scrape those flat spots to get them doing their share of the work.  Leave the tips stiff (flat) at this length.  Maybe the last 6 inches or so.  When the bow is unbraced, run the flat edge along the belly.  Observe the areas that have a gap while relaxed.  If those areas are say open 1/8 inch more than the surrounding areas, just add that 1/8 inch back to that, or those spots.  You don't need to put a ruler to it, just be aware that they started out bent when relaxed, so they should have more bend when braced and drawn, in order for them to be working enough.

[jrmeza]

Wow thanks for the help Slim, that helps me understand what my next move is going to be, which is huge to a new guy. I may know what the problem is, but knowing exactly how to fix it is a whole different story!

[TimBo]

I have never thought to do the straight edge to a relaxed bow, but have wondered how useful it is for goofy limbs...that's a very helpful tip.

[jrmeza]

Alrighty, here is the final tiller that I ended up with! I say final because I can't continue taking off from the belly or else the bow will be severely underweight (it's already lighter than my goal of 45-50 lbs).
But alas I must have more experienced folk's opinion so that I may continue to learn and understand this amazing craft. So what do y'all think of the tiller, and if it isn't perfect, is it "well enough" in your eyes? How far off am I? Be brutally honest please!!! I must know the truth!

[SLIMBOB]

Draw it by hand as if your shooting it and get a pic at full draw.  That will give a better profile.  What did the straight edge say on the left limb?

[bradsmith2010]

you are not that far off or the bow would break,, it could use some fine tune and hard to tell from the photo for me,,,so if you feel you are done then shoot it and see what happens ,, your eye will get better with experience,, it may be possible that later ,, you could cut the bow shorter and fine tune the tiller,, but for now,,,if you are happy shoot it,,

[jrmeza]

Thanks! and to Slim, the straight edge showed a pretty sizable gap dead in the middle of that weak spot you detected which is where a knot is. I did my best to try to even it out by sanding above and below the weak spot. Heres the pick at full draw


..... Not sure why it came out sideways... lol

[SLIMBOB]

Here you go.

The hinge on the bottom limb is a concern.  Is it kinked right there when unstrung?  If it is, as you said there is a knot there, then it might be ok like it is.  It's just hard to tell from the pic.  My guess is it could use a few more scrapes just above and below it.  You be the judge on that, armed with the information you got off the straight edge. I will typically heat straighten kinks like that so that it is easier to judge the tiller.  Your top limb looks to have a more subtle version of the same issue at the same spot but again, you make the call.  It looks better than the earlier pic.  Whomperty staves like yours are a challenge to tiller and the advice on how it looks from a photo are best guesses.
My advice is don't leave a weak hingie spot in the limb if you know you have a weak hingie spot.  If your good that it's not that, then carry on.  Congrats on what you have done btw.

[jrmeza]

Ummmm, it might be wishful thinking, but I think thats just the shape of the wood due to the inward turning knot that it has. That indentation just kinda came with the wood while I was roughing it out with a draw knife. Now does that mean it isn't a weak spot? I have no clue  Here are some close ups of that knot while the bow is unbraced, would you call that troublesome or just how the wood is formed? Or maybe I didn't follow the proper procedure when I encountered the knot. How is one supposed to carve knots during the roughing out stages of the stave? Man oh man this is quite the learning experience, thank you so much for helping me out to such an extent. I feel like my next bow I will be able to use my own expertise with all that I have learned from this.

[SLIMBOB]

If you run your thumb and forefinger along the back and belly, you should be able to feel that thin spot.  I am assuming that it is thin just past the knot on the belly?  If so it is both narrow and thin in that spot.  If I am reading it wrong then disregard, but if I am right it's a problem.  The thickness taper needs to be smooth with no dips or bumps.  You can feel them.  Easy to end up with a thin spot just after a knot like that as the drawknife tends to dig in there.  Just make note of it and be prepare for it on the next one.   

[jrmeza]

Yea, there isn't much more that I can do, as it has already been worked to a splinter, but as of now, it only took a bit of set, going from naturally reflexed to even between the tips and handle, which I am happy with! So I'm gonna throw a finish on, wrap some leather around it for grip, and shoot it for as long as she will let me! Hopefully now she will live a lot longer than she would have if I hadn't gotten so much advice! Thanks again Slim, keep on shooting on!

[SLIMBOB]

Hope some of it was helpful.  Making these bows is something one just has to do.  Especially on a stave like yours with all the humps and bumps, you just have to dive in and do your best.  Learn from it and improve on the next one.  Looking forward to seeing that one!

[Stringman]

Nothing to be ashamed of, there Jr. I like your motivated approach to this and expect to see many more bows from you in the future. My advise is to finish/shoot this one and then don't ever alter it. In 10 years you will want to look back and see where you've come from.