Author Topic: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon  (Read 58189 times)

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Offline DanaM

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2009, 10:42:41 am »
Well it seems we are all on the same page but from a different perspective.  ;)
  Dana, I am one of those certified liberals and have been for over 40 years but I don't live in a city. Maybe that's the difference!  ;D ;)

Yup I know Pat  ;) :D

Me I'm just a stubborn old Yooper :D
"Prosperity is a way of living and thinking, and not just money or things. Poverty is a way of living and thinking, and not just a lack of money or things."

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Offline El Destructo

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2009, 11:11:46 am »
Your a Liberal Pat?? ....I guess I am one in a way too....and I too believe that the Wolf should be here...just like the Moose. Deer, Bear, Coyote, Raptors....and the List goes on and on....It is up to Us to balance Nature to the Point that All Species can coexist again....We are the cause for it's imbalance to begin with....We are the ones taking away all of their natural range....and encroaching on them....not them on Us And as we will not quit encroaching....We need to find ways to ensure that no One Species takes the Brunt of Our advancements...they were all here first....and it would surely be a shame if they were decimated just for Us to build more Sub Divisions and Subburbs....I ain't getting all Misty Eyed either Dana.....I love to see Squirrels as much as I do Eagles when I am out in the Wilderness....and I think it would be a shame to lose any of them as a Species.....We owe it to the future generations to protect and to ensure that they are still here in a couple hundred years....and this will not just take Protection Laws....it will also take Harvesting some of these beautiful Creatures to keep everything in check.....JMHO
As a species we're fundamentally insane. Put more than two of us in a room, we pick sides and start dreaming up ways to kill one another.Why do you think we invented politics and religion.
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Offline paulc

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2009, 11:30:31 am »
There are plenty of deer and elk and moose to go around.  Considering most of us hunt for pleasure and the wolves hunt because they have no choice I think they might be entitled to a couple more than us.  I would bet less deer go to waste due to wolves than hunters...I am sure all of us "pure" archery hunters never waste anything from the animals we kill, right??  Manage the wolf population...I am all for it just remember we are not the center of the world so lets be good neighbors and share.

Offline Wolf Watcher

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2009, 12:05:50 pm »
Once again people who don't live here (Northwest Wyoming) have no clue as to the problems the planting of a non native species of wolves has caused people who make their living raising cattle for market!  We can't go back to the days where we as humans did not encroach on the territories of the wildlife.  If there was a small area for the wolves to live in the forests and national parks it would be different, but there are millions of acres of wild country for the wolves and grizzlies to habitate.  The problem is they kill livestock on private ground and with the present laws there is little to nothing the owners can do about it.  You are mistaken about the number of animals the wolves vs hunters waste in OUR area.  Send me your email address and I will send you some pictures that show the real story.  We are willing to live with outsiders planting non essential, non native wolves in Yellowstone, just give us the right to defend our livestock and wildlife by controlling the numbers of wolves and grizzlies!  None of you fellows love nature, its beauty and balance more than I do.  Watcher
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Offline DanaM

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #19 on: February 16, 2009, 12:22:07 pm »
See we all basically agree that wolves and all animals need protection but they also need to have control.
What the PETA and Humane Society of America want is to ban all hunting and let nature take its course,
right up till the deer are in their yards eating their landscaped yards, then ya call in a professional to make the
problem go away, under cover of darkness of course so they can pretend it didn't happen.

The problem with getting a season on wolves is mostly political and not tied to management principles in any way.
The end result is people will take it upon themselves to manage the wolf population :o Here in the UP in the area I hunt we had
a bad winter last year which resulted in many deer deaths, throw in the fawns taken by bobcat, bear, and yotes and the adult deer
that the wolves take, the car/deer deaths, crop damage permits, violators, etc  and their aren't many left for us hunters.

One other point and thats, we as sportsman pay through our license fees and taxes to maintain the wildlife population, the antis and
other so called animal rightests folk pay nothing but their voices apparently carry more weight with the politicians than anyone elses.

Your hunting rights are more in peril now than at any other point in history all hunters had best put their differences aside and band
together if we are going to continue to enjoy the right to hunt. If you don't believe me on this than you really need to get your head
out of the sand and open your eyes to the reality before you. The enemy is about to surround us and cut off all the escape routes at
that point ya might as well jump off the cliff as it will be less painful ;)
"Prosperity is a way of living and thinking, and not just money or things. Poverty is a way of living and thinking, and not just a lack of money or things."

Manistique, MI

Offline hawkbow

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #20 on: February 16, 2009, 12:49:53 pm »
I spend more time in the wilderness than most, so feel I can offer up a realistic account of OUR wolf problem.. I must admit that seeing or hearing one of these majestic creatures while in the back country does stir a feeling of being truly wild. Nothing is so beautiful as the call of a wolf on a cold fall morning, nor to lock eyes with a fellow predator in deep timber. But the romance ends there. You can't leave your dog or horses while you stalk elk , the wolves will kill a dog or horse and leave it lay. The packs around here are not wild, they are monitored constantly. Still they kill more livestock than Grizzlies, black bears and Mountain lions combined. I have personally found dozens of elk and moose kills where the animal was only partly consumed. the rest was left to waste >:( management of our wolves, consists of letting a pack grow, kill for a few years, then when they kill enough livestock.. The feds kill the wolves, and then let them rot >:( >:( this is not management, this is waste.... we as sportsmen have to decide, do we want to hunt elk, deer sheep moose, etc. or do we want wolves in our ecosystem.. we can not have both... too many super predators hunting the same area and the herds will, and have suffered signifficent loss. we hunt about three months around here.. the wolves have to hunt 365.. that adds up to a lot of dead elk... the grizz hunt and kill elk calves as they hit the ground in the spring.. wolves hunt the calves very efficiently through the summer months.. by fall it is not uncommon to see herds of fifty or more with few or no calves... my opinion on this subject is just that, my opinin... but there is no exception for experiences lived and seen in the high lands... if something is not done soon we could easily see an end to or hunting heritage in our childrens future...  Hawk
IT IS BETTER TO LOSE WITH HONOR. THAN TO WIN THROUGH DECEPTION...


Mike "Hawk" Huston

Offline Keenan

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #21 on: February 16, 2009, 03:19:43 pm »
  To all reading this thread:   I will pull this thread if it goes into a right or wrong debate!  I know how I feel as do others may have differing views and I respect that. But this thread was meant as an informative warning about changes in Oregon.   

 They are here,  that is the fact,  be it right or wrong.

 Please lets leave it at that and not start a discusion about Peta or animal vs. human rights  Thank you.   Keenan

Offline El Destructo

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #22 on: February 16, 2009, 03:54:49 pm »
                                      PETA....who brought that screwed up Bunch into this???

                                               To me this is what PETA stands for...... >:D

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As a species we're fundamentally insane. Put more than two of us in a room, we pick sides and start dreaming up ways to kill one another.Why do you think we invented politics and religion.
Think HEALTHCARE Is Expensive Now,Wait Till It's FREE
Do Or Do Not,There Is No TRY
2024...We Will Overcome

Offline hawkbow

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #23 on: February 16, 2009, 03:55:15 pm »
well said brother, sorry I got off on a rant... O:) Hawk
IT IS BETTER TO LOSE WITH HONOR. THAN TO WIN THROUGH DECEPTION...


Mike "Hawk" Huston

Offline Wolf Watcher

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2009, 04:35:38 pm »
You can pull this thread if you please!  I guess you are not interested in learning the truth about the wolf situation we live with!  Watcher
Get Close---Shoot Straight

Offline Pat B

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #25 on: February 16, 2009, 06:01:34 pm »
Hey Wolf Watcher, that is the wrong attitude to have. If the conversation can stay civil it won't be pulled.
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline DanaM

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2009, 06:26:32 pm »
I brought PETA into this, guilty as charged but ya can't talk about one without talking about the other now can ya.
In my opinion this has been a very civil debate, those of you without wolves in your area can't really understand the impact they have.

One of the downsides of this forum is that we can't really discuss what affects our shared interest in hunting and the future of the same >:(
I really think we need to be able to share our views and opinions on this issue as it affects all of us whether you hunt with selfbows, compounds or guns.

How about we start a thread in the Anything Else section on hunting rights or the lack thereof, after all fiberglass is allowed there why not allow hunting
issues and the threat to hunting posed by the antis? As long as it is kept civil whats the problem eh :)

Moderators I'm not trying to be a rabble rouser but it really is a big issue and a healthy debate never hurt anyone.

Just my humble opinion :)
"Prosperity is a way of living and thinking, and not just money or things. Poverty is a way of living and thinking, and not just a lack of money or things."

Manistique, MI

Offline Marc St Louis

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #27 on: February 16, 2009, 07:54:11 pm »
We are getting a healthy Wolf population up here and a lot of livestock are being killed.  It's a pity that PETA can't be made to foot the bill for all the domestic animals that are killed by Wolves.  Maybe then they would think twice about sticking their noses where it doesn't belong.   :)
Home of heat-treating, Corbeil, On.  Canada

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Offline DanaM

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #28 on: February 16, 2009, 07:58:45 pm »
Marc that is one of the best idea I've ever heard :)
"Prosperity is a way of living and thinking, and not just money or things. Poverty is a way of living and thinking, and not just a lack of money or things."

Manistique, MI

Offline hawkbow

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Re: Wolf sighting on Santiam pass in Oregon
« Reply #29 on: February 16, 2009, 10:28:55 pm »
Wolf watcher gets a little on top of this issue... He has been out in the mountains for the last weeks personally dealing with livestock kills and predation on his neighbors cattle and livestock by a pack of rogue wolves... the feds killed another pack that was slaying cattle a few weeks ago... all males, so much for the wolf family groups and natural hierarchy...any how I will let this issue go, it is hard to not get personal about an issue we have to live with out here.... everyone is allowed their personal views, but it is just too easy for others to get their feelings hurt with issues like the wolves... Happy hunting brothers, Hawk
IT IS BETTER TO LOSE WITH HONOR. THAN TO WIN THROUGH DECEPTION...


Mike "Hawk" Huston